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-   -   Sony HX9V (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/sony-34/sony-hx9v-183117/)

costa Jan 19, 2011 12:55 PM

Sony HX9V
 
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_HXaPyG-SY4...hx9+top_cr.jpg

What is better compared to the Sony HX5V?

* much better screen 640x480 from 320x240
* 1080p 50/60 fps at 28 Mps from 1080i 50/60 fps at 17 Mps
* better microphones with digital windfilter
* 16x zoom in the pocket from 10 x
* take 3 mp pictures while shooting non interrupted video - NEW
* 0.1 sec focus lock courtesy of the magnetic coil system - much slower before
* much better grip thanks to rubbery surface and rubber pad
* charge direct via USB cable (good also for emergency battery backup)
* mini HDMI (no more dongle)
* DSLR style Background Defocus
* much improved auto mode
* Beautyshot
* 3 image stacking when shooting against the sun
* better button layout
* MR mode and Custom button
* Scrollwheel
* looks better
* and lots of little thing

What is worse compared to the Sony HX5V?
16 Mp instead of 10 Mp

more info http://hx9v.blogspot.com/

viganet Jan 21, 2011 4:09 AM

Bigger mic holes = better audio perforamce ???
I hope...

costa Jan 24, 2011 10:52 AM

well the microphone plate got changed from the pre-production model, so I presume that this are got again optimized.
Also the modes on the mode dial got changed.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_HXaPyG-SY4...tion+model.jpg

viganet Jan 26, 2011 8:58 AM

I need a superzoom camera with fullhd video and good audio performance to shooting live concerts. Last year Sony = good video but terrible audio. Last year Panasonic = good audio but only 720 video.
Look at this year.....
Panny too is coming DMC-ZS10, but again a step behind Sony (1080i vs 1080p)

qv98 Feb 2, 2011 6:09 PM

i plan on getting this sucker :p

mackloon Feb 3, 2011 7:45 PM

i opted for the zs7 from panasonic, and while it is a fairly decent camera I wish I would have got the hx5v. I will be getting this one.

costa Feb 4, 2011 12:24 PM

looks like in Europe the Panasonic sz10 will be +50 Euro compared to the Sony HX9V
That would be a steep price for just a touch screen

mtclimber Feb 6, 2011 8:23 PM

Costa-

I am confused. It would seem that reducing the photo site size (such as was done on the HX9) would have negative effect on the image quality??

Sarah Joyce

costa Feb 16, 2011 5:36 AM

Sarah, I put a lot of explanation, graphics and links regarding this subject on the HC9V blog. You will find you answer there.
I also posted the links to the first HX5 10MP vs HX7V 16MP comparison and it is easy to see that the reduced photons make the HX7V pictures darker than the same from the HX5.
Sony had to change the default contrast and sharpness settings to compensate for the more softer image.
It seemed they did an OK job.

FiveO Feb 18, 2011 10:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mackloon (Post 1196959)
i opted for the zs7 from panasonic, and while it is a fairly decent camera I wish I would have got the hx5v. I will be getting this one.

I suspect you will be very sorely disappointed as the HX9V is likely to have even worse IQ than the already poor IQ of the HX5V. Good luck though.

viganet Feb 19, 2011 7:32 AM

Toh ! The ordinary Panny FanBoy has arrived here too.
Stay away..

costa Feb 19, 2011 6:23 PM

I have the first pre-production Sony HX9V samples on-line.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-S63tJoiSaU...5_HX7_cr+4.jpg
ISO 100 resized to 4MP original size crop

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-NXEGYJAzuU...00_HX7_cr4.jpg
ISO 1600 resized to 4MP original size crop

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-_0WsjJu4nj...om+16x_cro.jpg
16x zoom 100% crop from the original 16MP image

I like what I see so far
more at my blog

mtclimber Feb 19, 2011 7:34 PM

Costa-

The results look impressive on these initial photos. In fact, they look better than I expected.

Sarah Joyce

costa Apr 11, 2011 9:22 AM

comparing the HX9V with some DSLR cameras shows a good detail in the 16 MP


http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-BNdd_pd8wG...+people+fc.jpg
Sony HX9V


http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-IERQCfyMKX...+people+fc.jpg
Nikon D7000

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-KSaOnYzg_w...food+court.jpg
Sony A55

all pictures original size crop

more comparisons here:

http://hx9v.blogspot.com/2011/03/son...10-tz20-vs.htm

Dsherman73 Apr 11, 2011 3:28 PM

OK, I am seriously looking at this camera , However, any of the reviews and or people that post opinions seem to be from professionals. Which ok I can understand since this camera isn't out yet. What I am looking for is someone to look at the image quality from the perspective of the average Dad who is going to take pictures of the kids, school functions, Vacations, etc. I have a canon A720IS which I love and works great. I have already used that as my video camera(it captures standard Def) and my still in one device that I can take with me. The A720 takes good pictures.... well let me change that it takes good pictures , me on the other side of the camera not so much... The trouble I have with it is speed. when I hit the button to take the picture to waits a good second or two before taking. If I press the button half way to pre focus it's better but it took a long time for me to get to the point of feeling the half way point to focus. My wife still has trouble with that. I want a camera where I hit the button and it takes the picture really quickly. Then there is what I think you guys call shot to shot time. Where you take one picture to where you can take another. Well it takes a good 15 to 20 seconds while I am waiting for it to write to the card. Anew card helped a little but still a long time. I miss some good opportunities. Want a camera that will let you take a picture quickly and quickly you can take another shot. Also it struggles in low light. Playing with the manual mode and reading some of these forums I manage to get a pretty good result but very noisy and grainy, and smudgy if I don't hold still. And I am not about to carry a tripod with me. This camera(hx9v) has a night shot mode that clears the noisy and take a decent pic right? And it has to be fully automatic. Though I am a C tech person I really don't want to think about how to set up the camera before taking a quick pic. This camera seems to have a decent auto mode. The HDR mode looks neat also. Now for the million dollar question. I keep hearing about image quality. That it lacks fine detail, grass and other areas can become very smudgy and loose a lot of detail. I have looked through some samples and to my untrained eye I don't see the problems. However, my wife scrapbooks and I like to play around wit the pic in post processing once in a while. Basically cropping, sharpening, adding borders, text etc. Will I run into a problem with the pics if I play around too much? I will also use pictures to make little movies using pinnacle studio. Will the muddiness and loss of detail prevent me from doing this? also I heard this camera takes 3mp images while recording video. How are the quality of those stills? Does the video recording pause when the picture is taken? So if someone can just step out of the photographer realm for a few and take a look from an average persons perspective and give me some info. I will greatly appreciate it. thanks.

JohnWho Apr 11, 2011 5:45 PM

Hey Dsherman73 -

Does this review answer any of your questions?

http://www.digitalversus.com/sony-cy..._10599_16.html

Dsherman73 Apr 13, 2011 9:57 AM

I read that post, however it doesn't answer everything.

Video quality should be good as well as speed and low light should be OK, however I would still like to see what the 3mp pictures look like when taken in video. Dose the video stop or pause when the photo is taken? Also does it have any extra creative modes? IE, kids pets, fireworks, etc. IQ seems it will be OK for me. a non professional who scrapbooks and does basic editing, nothing fancy. We are going down to Disney World in august. It's my kids first trip and this camera looks like it will fit the bill. I was also looking at the Olympus sz-30MR but I haven't found ANY reviews on that, noting, not eve prerelease reviews? If anybody knows a place I can compair thy Olympus with the Sony it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

nantycoy Apr 13, 2011 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dsherman73 (Post 1218133)
I read that post, however it doesn't answer everything.

Video quality should be good as well as speed and low light should be OK, however I would still like to see what the 3mp pictures look like when taken in video. Dose the video stop or pause when the photo is taken? Also does it have any extra creative modes? IE, kids pets, fireworks, etc. IQ seems it will be OK for me.

I have an HX9V and love the video. To answer your questions:

There is no pause or stop when taking a still whilst videoing, nor does it make any noise or jerk (providing you press gently). I have to admit I haven't used the 3Mp option yet, I'm still blown away by AVCHD PS (28Mbps) @ 50p.

You have two options in movie mode, iAuto or Sceen. In Scn you have: Soft Snap, Landscape, Twilight, High Sensitivity, Beach and Snow. iAuto will chose what it thinks is suitable.

You can browse the manual on my website :

www.monmouthweather.co.uk/hx9v/index.html

but sorry there is no .pdf manual - Sony, in their wisdom, are only providing it in html format, which means printing it out is a no go. Grrrr~!

Oh, and...
Low sensitivity is good, you can pre-set the ISO compensation prior to recording but the only option you have when recording a movie is to activate the Focus Tracking.


Chris

JohnWho Apr 13, 2011 12:17 PM

I don't have the camera, but there is a link to the User's Guide:

http://www.monmouthweather.co.uk/HX9V/index.html

Maybe that will answer some more of your questions.

Macbeth Apr 13, 2011 2:12 PM

Will there be different versions of the HX9V for USA (NTSC) and
Europe (PAL), or can I always select between 50/60 fps?

Which movie recording mode suits best for iMovie '11?
The HX9V is on the iMovie compatibility list, but how can this work?
It's a AVCHD 1080/60p camera -- but iMovie supports only 24/25/30 fps!
Will every second frame be lost?

Thanks!

nantycoy Apr 14, 2011 3:19 AM

[QUOTE=Macbeth;1218180]Will there be different versions of the HX9V for USA (NTSC) and
Europe (PAL), or can I always select between 50/60 fps?

You cannot switch, Eu is PAL @ 50p AND limited to 29 minutes (to avoid Eu camcorder taxation).

Macbeth Apr 14, 2011 3:49 AM

Thanks! I think I'd have to order a 60p model from outside the EU then...

... and does some one know about how the iMovie compatibility works?

Dsherman73 Apr 14, 2011 9:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Macbeth (Post 1218327)
Thanks! I think I'd have to order a 60p model from outside the EU then...

... and does some one know about how the iMovie compatibility works?



Being a PC tech I can help with this one. Any video format can be converted after the fact. It just sometimes takes a while to convert depending on the speed of your system and if your software uses any hardware acceleration. I believe i Movie will convert automatically but I am not 100% sure. If you go over to this site

http://www.videohelp.com/

it should give you all the answers you need. It has forums and tools and programs etc. All just on video editing and such.

Macbeth Apr 14, 2011 12:36 PM

Thanks for the link!

Scotious May 18, 2011 7:26 PM

Just to follow-up on this thread with some real world experience. Today a Sony tech took over my computer for an hour and a half trying to figure out how-in-the-world to import a 1080p (60P) 28 Mbps clip from my HVX9. Import where? ANYWHERE! Just get the thing on my computer somehow.

He could not-- and finally decreed it impossible.

I then went to the Apple store and sat with a genius to try and achieve the same thing.

He could NOT. And this is what we all learned today:

iMovie WILL import all the resolutions of clips from the HX9 EXCEPT the 1080p (60P) resolution. Same for Final Cut Pro. To access those highest resolution clips you must pull them off your SD card and convert them.

First, to locate them, drill down into your SD card to:

NO NAME >>> Private >>> AVCHD >>> BDMV >>> STREAM >>> 00001.MTS (etc.)

THERE are your video clips. The only player I have found that will play these files is the VLC (bless them):

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/

Now you must find a way to convert these to a format you can actually use.

For this, I have Toast Titanium 10, and it does a beautiful job. Here is a clip I uploaded to Youtube full of terrible camerawork and a fun song that just happened to be on CBC2 at the time:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzyysnM8jvk

Go ahead; watch it in full 1080P, I dare ya!

The only down side is that my 1 minute 47 second clip which was originally 337MB became a 1.87 clip when converted to H.264 best quality, single pass. But, gosh darnit, this is the best video I have ever seen on a $350.00 point and shoot camera. Especially effective was the anti-shake feature which resulted in running footage smooth enough to actually use.

Hope this was useful to somebody...

--Scott

Macbeth May 18, 2011 9:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotious (Post 1227631)
Just to follow-up on this thread with some real world experience. Today a Sony tech took over my computer for an hour and a half trying to figure out how-in-the-world to import a 1080p (60P) 28 Mbps clip from my HVX9. Import where? ANYWHERE! Just get the thing on my computer somehow.
He could not-- and finally decreed it impossible.
I then went to the Apple store and sat with a genius to try and achieve the same thing.
He could NOT.

Scotious, that Toast conversion... is it lossless?
Before I bought the SONY HX9V I checked the SONY and iMovie '11
compatibility lists - the camera is on both!
I found a native sample movie and just re-wrapped the 1080/60p MTS
using ClipWrap (http://www.divergentmedia.com/clipwrap) to AIF,
which iMovie accepts as a 1080/30p without any problem.
I guess it simply skips each second frame.
Export quality is better than with my 800 camcorder. :D

Scotious May 19, 2011 8:29 AM

>>that Toast conversion... is it lossless?<<

I didn't try-- i used the H.264, best quality setting. I find this really looks good on most video. But Clipwrap looks really good, and I will try that. File size does seem to be the bigaboo with these things, though. Do you have any stats I can use to compare?


>>Before I bought the SONY HX9V I checked the SONY and iMovie '11
compatibility lists - the camera is on both!<<

They just fail to mention that neither company's software recognizes the highest-resolution video.

>>I found a native sample movie and just re-wrapped the 1080/60p MTS
using ClipWrap (http://www.divergentmedia.com/clipwrap) to AIF, <<

Do you really mean AIF? isn't that audio only format (Audio Interchange File Format)

>>Export quality is better than with my 800 camcorder. <<

Amazing, isn't it?

I LOVE the easy panoramas, too.

Best, Scott

Macbeth May 19, 2011 8:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotious (Post 1227736)
>>I found a native sample movie and just re-wrapped the 1080/60p MTS
using ClipWrap (http://www.divergentmedia.com/clipwrap) to AIF, <<

Do you really mean AIF? isn't that audio only format (Audio Interchange File Format)

Sorry, I meant AIC (Apple Intermediate Codec)!

Using ClipWrap you avoid double lossy conversion.
(Toast conversion + iMovie import to AIC.)
You can compare the quality - the test version (up to 1 minute) is free.

Scotious May 19, 2011 9:02 AM

Ahhh...AIC. Thx. Clipwrap = $50.00 -- I will do a comparison--

sbcooler May 19, 2011 6:56 PM

I have a the trial version of ClipWrap and my friend sent me the original files off of the camera. I can play the 1080i60 no problem.

Now when I put the mts file in ClipWrap that is 1080p60, if I choose AIC I only get an audio file. No video. If I select the option to rewrap with no conversion it opens up, but the screen is blank. I want to convert the original file that 1080p60 to AIC 1080i60 so I can edit it.

How did you get ClipWrap to convert the file properly to AIC? I get nothing but an audio file only if I do it that way.

Thanks.

Scotious May 20, 2011 8:25 PM

Why, yes-- I just tried the demo of ClipWrap and found exactly the same thing. Audio only. No matter how I convert it. Any advice Macbeth?

sbcooler May 20, 2011 11:15 PM

If clipwrap does not let you take the 1080p60 and convert it to a viewable format on an Apple mac, then I see one other alternative. Someone said something about using Toast to do the conversion.

Can someone spell out the exact steps in order to do this? I don't want to spend the money on clipwrap or Toast 11 unless it actually works.

Any other alternatives? I'd like to take the 1080p60 and somehow get it to 1080p30 into a compliant format Apple iMovie or Final Cut Pro will understand.

I wonder if the new Final Cut Pro will play allow all these new formats...anyone?

Scotious May 21, 2011 7:25 AM

>>Someone said something about using Toast to do the conversion. <<

I did-- a cuppla posts ago. It's a no-brainer so I won't go into the steps here. And I posted the link to the beautiful h.264 that Toast 10 made to youtube. The link is there, too. This file is easily imported to FCP.

>>I wonder if the new Final Cut Pro will play allow all these new formats...anyone?<<

Don't know, but previous version will not, natively anyway.

Scotious May 22, 2011 8:40 AM

Did find this free app. which does seem to re-wrap loss-lessly and audio remains intact Actually had to experiment with settings to re-encode and retain audio. Use aac (not AC3).

http://www.nef.wh.uni-dortmund.de/%7Emt/remux/

sbcooler May 22, 2011 12:56 PM

I do not have Toast 10....and it's $80. If you could spell out the steps within Toast 10 that would make me feel more confident in buying it.

Is it a 1 step process or 2 step. Right now I have 2 conversions. I use Hand Bake to convert to an .m4v file and then I import that into Final Cut Pro 5.1.4 and export out as an AIC file. Anyway, that's a 2 step process and takes a ton of time. I figure a 2 hour convert I will tape (8 angles) will take 6 days per 2 hour clip.

Is Toast 10 faster. Again the final output file I need is something like AIC where I can edit it in Final Cut Pro 5.1.4.

Thanks for your patience.


Quote:

Originally Posted by Scotious (Post 1228203)
>>Someone said something about using Toast to do the conversion. <<

I did-- a cuppla posts ago. It's a no-brainer so I won't go into the steps here. And I posted the link to the beautiful h.264 that Toast 10 made to youtube. The link is there, too. This file is easily imported to FCP.

>>I wonder if the new Final Cut Pro will play allow all these new formats...anyone?<<

Don't know, but previous version will not, natively anyway.


Scotious May 22, 2011 7:31 PM

SB-- did you try the re-wrapper I found?

http://www.nef.wh.uni-dortmund.de/%7Emt/remux/

Try it-- the re-wrapping process is much faster than re-encoding.

The Toast process is only one step to convert to QT, but of course you will need to import that to FCP and then out again. That encoding took about 10 min. for my 2 min. -- pretty time consuming for a two hour show ( 8 cameras really?)

Good luck-- Scott

sbcooler May 23, 2011 11:55 AM

I haven't tried it yet. I'm curious, you rewrap it fine...then it's a quicktime file..and then what..you import that new clip into Final Cut Pro and export it to AIC or PRORES or whatever you want to edit in...is that the process?

HandBrake works pretty well for converting the 1080p60 to a .m4v file. And it's about 5:1 on my computer. Taking that file and exporting out to AIC (1080p30) was taking my machine something like 60:1. So if I have a 2 hour concert, then that's about 130 hours or about 5 days. Damn! And if I have 8 angles that's 40 days!

Is your way of doing it faster than that? I think the next version of Final Cut Pro will be out before then and maybe they'll be a way to speed this up 10x! I hope. Pain in the ass.

Scotious May 23, 2011 9:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbcooler (Post 1228632)
I haven't tried it yet. I'm curious, you rewrap it fine...then it's a quicktime file..and then what..you import that new clip into Final Cut Pro and export it to AIC or PRORES or whatever you want to edit in...is that the process?

HandBrake works pretty well for converting the 1080p60 to a .m4v file. And it's about 5:1 on my computer. Taking that file and exporting out to AIC (1080p30) was taking my machine something like 60:1. So if I have a 2 hour concert, then that's about 130 hours or about 5 days. Damn! And if I have 8 angles that's 40 days!

Is your way of doing it faster than that? I think the next version of Final Cut Pro will be out before then and maybe they'll be a way to speed this up 10x! I hope. Pain in the ass.

I guess I don't get why you are not editing in FCP. Why do you have to "export to AIC or PRORES" to edit? Don't you edit first, THEN export?

Even on my old G5 tower my export times to high quality h.264 files were about 10:1, now about 1:1 on my new Imac. I was doing some long form stuff, too, so my 3 hour seminars would take about 30 hrs. to render. Painful! Have you tried going to h.264? What Mac do you own?

Again I ask-- are you really shooting eight different cameras on a two hour program. How can you possibly do that on anHX9V?

set2374 May 26, 2011 9:38 AM

I am impressed that you guys have the patience to work with 1080p at 60fps video--other than to see if you can do it. I just bought a HX7v and I am having a hell of a time getting my computer to handle AVCHD video shot at 17 and 24mbps rates. Curiously, my Canon HG10 shoots 1080i at 19mbps rates and my computer seems to handle it just fine. Is there anything special about the algorithm Sony is using that is mucking up some of our computers?

I am using a windows computer with a Core 2 Duo P8600 chip (2.4ghz and 8mb cache), 4 gigs of ram and a discrete ATI Radeon HD 4600 graphics chip and my computer still is choking on the mid and high (for the HX7v) AVCHD video (when viewed on VLC or any other player). I am getting pretty good results with 1080p MP4 at 12mbps and 1440x1080 AVCHD quality. If I would have to convert the higher profile files to mp4 or some other format, there's really no point in using them at all--at least for me.

I am also having another with excessive noise when filming with zoom above 6x in normal indoor (night time) lighting--particularly when shooting dark objects. I haven't seen that complaint anywhere else. Am I doing something wrong??

UPDATE: The excessive noise was only at night, in low/mixed halogen lighting. I tried duplicating the video with my JVC Everio GZ-HM300 mid-level HD camcorder and found that the HX7v IQ was around the same as the JVC in low light with both cameras producing useable, but not great video. In better lit conditions and in daylight, the quality on the Sony is great--certainly as good as any mid-range HD camcorder I have used (and not too far off from my Canon HG10).

Macbeth May 28, 2011 9:22 AM


iMovie '11 can't yet import the HX9V's 1080x1920/60p footage directly.
 (BTW A good player for these 60p MTS files on the Mac is Movist (http://code.google.com/p/movist/downloads/list - FREE).)


You can use the Rewrap2M4V script (https://discussions.apple.com/message/11316343#11316343 - FREE - Note: Read this thread to have all required parts installed.), remux (http://www.nef.wh.uni-dortmund.de/%7Emt/remux/ - FREE) or ClipWrap (http://www.divergentmedia.com/clipwrap/trial - latest version 2.3: $50) to convert (losslessly) to M4V or MOV, what iMovie can handle as 1080/30p.



For Rewrap2M4V and remux:

Rewrap to M4V files (losslessly!) which you can import (using 'optimize') in iMovie to AIC (the normal working format in iMovie).



For ClipWrap:

NOT just rewrap, but directly convert to AIC (always check 'Convert Audio to LPCM' - that's what iMovie needs). Then when you import the resulting MOV files into iMovie you'll notice that this goes more quickly, because iMovie has no more work to do - just "double checks" the files (no matter with or without 'optimize' checked - it's ignored).



I've checked thoroughly and can confirm that all 3 methods bring the same high quality output when I finally export using iMovie at 20Mbps (standard MOV export setting).



Note 1: Of course you can use Toast (expensive), but I don't know if the conversion quality is lossy.

Note 2: As far as I know Handbrake can't just rewrap to m4v - only convert (lossy).



I hope at least one method will work for you too!


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