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Old May 4, 2006, 6:37 PM   #41
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royco wrote:
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Thanks jim, I think I may have a hard time with the 433D, Im kinda slow with manual settings plus trying to guess which exposure will be right for the flash is tough(is it?).
No... Actually it's not tough. ;-)

These are Auto flashes (in the sense that the flash is capable of throttling it's own ouput, based on how much reflected light it sees for the aperture range selected).

The models they're discussing have 3 auto ranges.

These ranges have different distances from short to long they can be used at.

One of the ranges probably runs around 3 to 22 feet at f/5.6 and ISO 200.

So, just set the camera to the same aperture and ISO speed, and let the flash control it's own output within the range selected.

Shutter speed makes no difference for the amount of light the camera is seeing from the flash. That's because the flash burst is very short (my Sunpak 333 Auto will use a flash length of between 1/1200 second and 1/20000 second).

The only reason to vary shutter speed with a flash exposure is either to allow more or less ambient light in, or to make sure shutter speeds are fast enough to prevent motion blur if there is a lot of ambient light contributing.

That's why many cameras simply set the camera to a fixed shutter speed of around 1/60 second when you use the built in flash. It's a compromise setting. The flash burst length is then varied to control the actual exposure.

If you set it to around 1/100 second, that will be fine for the majority of indoor conditions where you'd need a flash if you are using something like ISO 200 and f/5.6.

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Any other flash suggestions that'll work in AV mode thats not too pricey?
It depends on what you mean by pricey.

Metz 40MZ3 with the correct SCA3302M5 or M6 foot. No HSS with it, though. You'd need to go with the Metz 54MZ3 or 54MZ4 with the SCA3302M5 or M6 foot to get HSS.

You don't have HSS with the Sunpaks anyway though.

I've heard a few people mention using a Promaster flash of some type. Personally, I don't think I'd buy a flash that didn't have an Auto mode (capable of using it's own sensor to measure reflected light during the exposure, versus relying on a preflash like the KM strobes use).


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Old May 4, 2006, 6:50 PM   #42
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You make it sound so simple jim, Ill go ahead and get one and try it out. Thanks for the explanation.
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Old May 4, 2006, 7:08 PM   #43
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A number of similar Sunpak models will work.

I've got a Sunpak 333 Auto I paid $25 for in 10 condition (as new in box) form B&H.

But, I see them on Ebay for under $10 relatively often.

The trick is to make sure you've getting an Auto Flash that can be fired via an ISO standard Hotshoe (and you'll need the Minolta FS-1100 or equivalent adapter for the camera), that has the available auto aperture ranges and power (GN) you need.

Even when some of these units have shoes designed for older Minolta models (or even dedicated to a totally different camera model), you'll still need an adapter, and the extra flash foot pins just aren't used.

You're only taking advantage of the auto ranges on the strobes (although most also have manual power settings you can choose), and don't care about the dedicated part (since the older Sunpaks like these aren't going to work dedicated with your camera anyway).

You'll also need to make sure that trigger voltage isn't too high. KM has never published trigger voltage limts for the hotshoes. So, it would probably be a good idea to make sure you don't use a strobe that has a trigger voltage much over around 8 or 9 volts (since the hotshoe could be designed for 6 volts).

Most of the Sunpaks we've been discussing fall into that category. But, that's not the case for some of them. You can see a list of trigger voltage for some strobes here:

http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html

These older strobes don't give you as much flexibility for using the aperture/ISO speed combinations you may want to (and you lose features like HSS and wireless).

But, you don't need to worry about a preflash (or any associated metering problems), and they are inexpensive solutions.

There isn't a big market for non-dedicated auto strobes anymore, since most users don't want to mess around with setting the camera and flash to match. As a result, they are dirt cheap on the used market if you're a good shopper.


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Old May 4, 2006, 8:39 PM   #44
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JimC wrote:
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The trick is to make sure you've getting an Auto Flash that can be fired via an ISO standard Hotshoe (and you'll need the Minolta FS-1100 or equivalent adapter for the camera), that has the available auto aperture ranges and power (GN) you need.

Do I need this FS-1100 adapter with the 433D?
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Old May 4, 2006, 8:50 PM   #45
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Do I need this FS-1100 adapter with the 433D?
Yes, to use a flash like this in the hotshoe, you'll need an adapter. The newer Maxxum/Dynax models (including the DSLR models like the 5D and 7D) have a proprietary hotshoe design.

The FS-1100 is designed to let you use strobes with an ISO standard foot.

Even if you get a 433D that is dedicated to Minolta, it's still not going to mount without an adapter (since they were designed for older Minolta cameras). You don't have to find one dedicated to Minolta at all. If you see a 433D for Nikon models, it will work, too (via the FS-1100 adapter), since you're not using the extra pins with these strobes.

If you can't find an FS-1100 at a good price (and they are getting to be hard to find), I've got a 3rd party adapter like this one that does the same thing (plus it gives me a PC Sync Port since my 5D doesn't have one).

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...tem=7615342036

If you search for FS-1100, the same vendor has multiple listings for them.
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Old May 5, 2006, 3:03 AM   #46
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rduve wrote:
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Thank you, that's good to know. Can that be saved as a custom setting, so you can call it up at the switch of a button, everytime you attach the flash? I.E. If you rotate the WB button to Custom will it retain the previous setting?

Answering my own question: Yes the camera does retain the previous custom settings. And Randy's suggestion is right on. This was shot at 5500K and +1 Magenta. One could not ask for a more perfect white balance.


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Old May 5, 2006, 3:06 AM   #47
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But then again the AWB looks about the same in this case (except for the extra +1 magenta).But using the custom setting one canachieve more consistent results because the camera will not gauge the white balance based on the ambient light.





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Old May 5, 2006, 7:12 AM   #48
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I see something in this picture that you missed. You need to help your wife with the dishes!:P



Seriously, the white on that bleach bottle couldn't be any whiter.
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Old May 5, 2006, 7:15 AM   #49
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In case any 7D owners are following the thread...

The Magenta/Green composition feature when setting white balance is not availablewith the 7D. This was a new feature added to the 5D.


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Old May 5, 2006, 7:59 AM   #50
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JimC wrote:
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In case any 7D owners are following the thread...

The Magenta/Green composition feature when setting white balance is not availablewith the 7D. This was a new feature added to the 5D.

Jim,

A little off topic, but regarding the +1 compensation on the 5600HS with the 7D: has this been an issue with the 5D as well? I haven't used mine that much, but it seems fine, even on close up pictures.
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