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Old May 22, 2007, 10:12 PM   #1
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Excuse me if this has already been covered, but I just recently purchased an H7 and for the life of me I can't find anywhere in the menu to check if camera is in fine or standard jpeg, or for that matter to even change it. Thanks for your help in advance.
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Old May 22, 2007, 11:31 PM   #2
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You can't. (*)

There is no menu option. For still pics anyway, movie mode still has that option.

Pre-production models might have had it, in fact some Sony support/help staff claim their camera has it, but the camera released to the public does not.

In fact most of the latest models from Sony do not have this option, and yes Sony literature says the camera does, and maybe it did at one time, but no longer.

Thats one of the major problems with the camera, the pictures at 8megapixels are very very small compared to other 8mp camera files ie too much compression, plus of course the dubious problems with noise reduction kicking in even at very low ISOs and removing the fine detail in things like grass, foliage, eyebrows etc.

And of course the higher than average lens distortions at wide angle, the purple/green fringing etc.

Go over to the Sony Talk Forum at http://www.dpreview.com and read any of the various threads covering this problem.

Many have pointed out that older 4 and 5 mp cameras never mind modern cameras are totally out classing the H9s pictures.

Now there is nothing wrong with autofocus speeds etc, top of the digicam class there, it's the pictures causing the problems.

Too much compression, too much or unpredictable noise reduction (at all isos) and no way to change either.

Many are praying for a firmware upgrade to fix these problems, even if burst speed etc slows down in the process.

Many have returned the camera in disgust, some have got a second camera and claimed the worse image problems are gone, but still, the fine details expected of a flagship camera do not seem to be there.

The camera seems to be excellent for macro pictures, closeups etc, but landscapes suffer, and so do portraits, fine detail is lost even when it should not.

Don't get me wrong, many love the camera, butthe picture qualitydoes not shine compared to pictures from the H2/H5 or even the 5megapixel H1, and thats a shame.



(*) I think it has been found that if you shoot at 5mp the compression is slightly less, but then again whats the point of shooting a 8mp camera at 5mp ?

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Old May 23, 2007, 6:28 AM   #3
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Sintares wrote:
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Thats one of the major problems with the camera, the pictures at 8megapixels are very very small compared to other 8mp camera files ie too much compression, plus of course the dubious problems with noise reduction kicking in even at very low ISOs and removing the fine detail in things like grass, foliage, eyebrows etc.

And of course the higher than average lens distortions at wide angle, the purple/green fringing etc. ......


Now there is nothing wrong with autofocus speeds etc, top of the digicam class there, it's the pictures causing the problems.

Too much compression, too much or unpredictable noise reduction (at all isos) and no way to change either......

The camera seems to be excellent for macro pictures, closeups etc, but landscapes suffer, and so do portraits, fine detail is lost even when it should not.......

(*) I think it has been found that if you shoot at 5mp the compression is slightly less, but then again whats the point of shooting a 8mp camera at 5mp ?
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Sintares,
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You have done alot of H9 reading. You make your statements about the H9 with quite an authoritive ring to them.
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When I look at my results with my H9, and read your statememts, I ask myself 'Is he talkng about the Sony H9?'
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Three issues:
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1) Portraits from my H9 are really good. Color, Tonality & Detail.
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2) You must view the images on a HD TV to realize what Sony has accomplished with the H9. When doing so, please remember Sony's market audience for the H9. 95% will be very, very pleased seeing their child on their HD TV in such real life fidelity.
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3) Landscapes? What can any 1 1/8" sensor really be expected to accomplish? The H9 does very well again. I have the following images to illustrate this fact. It is of the Brooklyn Bridge, shot this Monday. Main focus is on the near railing. The original image was PP with Auto Levels and Focus Magic at 2 at 50%. I PP this way to overcome two issues: 1) main focus is on the near railing; 2) This shot really calls for a Circular Polarizer ( which I ordered, expected delivery is 5/26/2007).
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IMHO, this is really a really fantastic performance for a Handheld shot. Actually this was shot with my Slingshot method and my remote.
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Following are 5 images, the original and then 100% crops of my PP Tiff file:
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Thanks for the exchange of ideas.
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Nicholas
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PS: Next time I will shoot this image with my tripod and circular polarizer with focus on the bridge. Will post in separate thread.
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Image 1
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Old May 23, 2007, 6:29 AM   #4
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Image 2 of 5:
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Old May 23, 2007, 6:30 AM   #5
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Image 3 of 5:
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Old May 23, 2007, 6:31 AM   #6
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Image 4 of 5:
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Old May 23, 2007, 6:33 AM   #7
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Image 5 of 5:

Regards,

Nicholas
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Old May 23, 2007, 12:31 PM   #8
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Hi again Nick

Yep, your photo's look ok when reduced to this size, I presume you are trying to say your camera is ok which it is if this is the size you will view/print at, but the truth is that your camera has image problems as well.

Check just one of youroriginal's I have linked here and you only have look in the top left in the branches and bridge to see purple and green fringing, of course if you reduce down to a small size as you have posted sampleshere you will hardly notice it, if you need more links to your originalimages showing fringing let me know.the averageconsumer will not worry too much as most will print at 6x4.

http://www.nickphoto123.smugmug.com/...67308/Original


In fact even pic #3 in this thread the building on the left and the one next to it show PF on the verticalright handside even though it has been reduced from the original. Your last shot #5if you look at the verticalmiddle posthas green fringing on the right hand side of said post.

Incidently your statement above......."3) Landscapes? What can any 1 1/8" sensor really be expected to accomplish?"...... is wrong, the H9 uses 1/2.5" sensor which is a lot smaller than 1/1.8",IMHOif it had this sensor there would not be a lot of the problems that are happening.

Please note this has nothing to do with your photographic skills, just pointing out this camera has IQ problems.

my 2 cents


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Old May 23, 2007, 2:06 PM   #9
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This camera has been discussed alot at the forum of dpreview. and there're some IQ problems from many users. H9 was packedinto manyfeatures but without excellent IQ, i don't know why we're so excited about this camera.(most of us presume its IQ must be good like its PredecessorH2/H5).

i'll also waitfor steve or dpreview's review. The odds of buying this camera doesn't look so good to me now.may have tolook for something else:?

review that i posted b4:

http://www.neocamera.com/review_sony_h9_more.html
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Old May 23, 2007, 3:11 PM   #10
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You really should read the review and verdict on the H9 by Cameralabs..

Also check out the outdoor results when the pictures from the H9 are compared with ones from the Pany Fz8.

Cameralabs say.

The third row of crops also show the H9 resolves far less fine detail in the foliage areas than the FZ8, even at a slightly lower sensitivity of 80 ISO. This is due to higher compression and greater noise reduction, neither of which are adjustable on the H9.

So even at its lowest sensitivity under the best conditions, the Sony H9 images have several worrying issues. If you like to view results on-screen at 100% or make large prints, the H9's results can disappoint.

Two quotes from the verdict sums things up..

Heading the worryingly long list of downsides though is image quality

Like other super-zooms though, smearing through noise reduction is a serious problem with the H9, but probably its biggest failing is not giving you a chance to do anything about it. Maybe Sony's engineers realised there actually isn't anything you can do about it, but it's fair to say many of us would have liked a fighting chance.


Many things weasked for in thenext H series camera wheregranted.

Wewanted faster burst and faster flash - granted :-)

We wanted faster autofocus for those bird in flight shots - granted :-)

We wanted a wider lens - granted (but only to 31mm) but its slower at telephoto :roll:

We wanted raw - no :sad:

We wanted a hotshoe oraccport for connecting to external flashes - no :sad:

We wanted the same excellent image quality as the H1H2 and H5 - no :sad:

We wanted to be able to use those expensive accessorieswe already had, the dh1758 tcon and the 0758 wide angle- no :sad: New more expensive versions, different and totally non standardsizes.. means buying Sony or waiting for someone (Pemaraal) to produce step-up or down rings to fit.

And of course wegot the tiny sensor even further stuffed with pixels and the lack of fine compression andno way to control theextreme noise reduction removing fine details and the extreme lens adding even more fringing and distortion.. Thanks Sony



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