Steve's Digicams Forums

Steve's Digicams Forums (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/)
-   What Camera Should I Buy? (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/what-camera-should-i-buy-80/)
-   -   New to digital SLR (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/what-camera-should-i-buy-80/new-digital-slr-106153/)

sacstella Nov 9, 2006 10:23 PM

I want a digital SLR to use as way of a new hobby, (with professional potential.)
My subjects will mainly be people. I may want to use this camera at weddings/birthdays/concerts/family photos/headshots- when making a suggestion, please take this into consideration.

I am not so much concerned at the price range- as I am to making sure I get what is right for me. Because this is a new hobby for me, I am considering under buying what my needs are, but not by much. I'd like something I could grow into & conquer. Not something that would overwhelm me with features.

I have narrowed the brands to either Nikon or Canon.

PLEASE HELP!!!

jabilson007 Nov 11, 2006 4:23 PM

Nikon seems to have better flash features for the beginner, eg. wireless, with d70s and d80. You will probably need this capability for the situations you described, except for concerts, which with Canon's lower noise at the highest ISOs would be the better choice.

sacstella Nov 11, 2006 11:06 PM

Canon? Please tell me more.

pagerboy Nov 12, 2006 10:43 AM

Have you handheld each of the cameras? I like the Canon's smaller cameras and menu setup.

sacstella Nov 13, 2006 12:34 AM

I am familiar with both brands. I favor Nikon. But, truth is Canon is a great brand too. I think I will go to Ritz and hold a few of the newer models.

I am looking at the Nikon D70 and D80. What do you think of these cameras?


JohnG Nov 13, 2006 6:30 AM

For your stated purposes, both Canon and Nikon make great cameras.In the Canon camp, the 5d is the preferred non-pro option because it's full frame. But, the Nikon D80 is, based on it's specs and limited reviews an outstanding camera and will absolutely be capable of meeting your needs.

But, for portraits, weddings, concerts you have to realize that your success is going to be more dependent upon the lenses you buy. Lenses I mention are from the Canon camp since that's what I'm familiar with but Nikon will have very similar lenses. Even if the focal lengths aren't the same they'll be close - what is highly important is the apertures.

For weddings, a typicall lens setup might be: 24-70 2.8 ($1000), 70-200 2.8 ($1100), 85mm 1.8 ($370), 135mm 2.0 ($950). Plus you need a good flash and flash bracket ($300-400).

Portrait work: Good tripod & head ($200 +), 85mm 1.8 ($370), 50mm 1.4 ($300), probably others - I don't do much portrait work. If you want to do serious portrait work you'll need a strobe setup (alien bees makes popular starter packs for a few hundred $$$) plus a light meter.

Concerts: Concerts are typically very low light. You're more often than not going to be shooting at high ISO 1600-3200 and requiring a fast prime lens (2.0 or better). Which prime lens, of course, depends on your distance from the stage. If you're more than 30-40 yards from the stage I wouldn't even worry about getting good concert photos - you're too far away to get enough detail with the lenses you're likely to have available that are bright enough to take a shot.

So, as others have suggested - get a feeling for the camera body you like - but in the end, for your stated purposes, the lenses and accessories are going to be far more important to your success than the camera body you choose.

BenjaminXYZ Nov 13, 2006 7:23 AM

If you are considering the Nikon D80 & the Nikon D70s, you should also take a look at the Sony Alpha dSLR-A100, Canon EOS 400D, and probably the upcoming Pentax K10D as well.

The Nikon D80 have a lot of custom features, solid build quality, great ergonomics, speedy performance, great battery life,advance flash system, fast auto-focus, good buffer, and a great pentaprism TTL viewfinder.

The Sony Alpha dSLR-A100 have a build in shake reduction, anti-dust/removal feature, great continuous shooting performance, and advance dynamic range controls. (It is also great in other areas)

The Pentax K10D will also be having a great pentaprism TTL viewfinder, weather sealed body, special modes, build in anti-shake, build in anti-dust/removal system, and the 22 bit (color) deptCCD. (No proper reviews yet...wait for more proven "great" features.)

The CanonEOS 400D have a wide range of image perimeter settings, excellent image quality, very fast performance, much improved continuous shooting performance, good high ISO performance, extra bright 230,000 pixels TFT LCD,EOS 30D's auto-focus engine, and the build in anti-dust/dust removal system. (It is great also, in other aspects)

The Nikon D70s have one of the best high ISO performance around, and it has a host of other advance features too: Very crisp image quality, superior ergonomics, responsive, solid build quality, robust design, a great grip, advance flash system, great battery life, good range of custom settings, fast auto-focus,deep "intelligent"buffering system, greatcontinuous shooting performance,speedy performance, and a host of other functions.

EDITED.


JohnG Nov 13, 2006 7:38 AM

Analysis Paralysis warning:

Let me take a crack at restating what Ben is saying - virtually every DSLR on the market is great and has great features. But I caution against getting caught up in analysis paralysis - that is, considering so many cameras and reading so many reviews that you never end up buying a camera.

If you've narrowed it down (for whatever reasons) to a couple models - stick with those. Hand hold those and see which you like.

You could spend months and months reading reviews and get caught up in marketing babble and new features that, in the end, aren't going to make as much difference as the glass you use AND, most importantly, the hands-on practice you can get by actually buying and using the camera.

I gaurantee you'r skill will be the limiting factor - far more so than the camera body (and I don't mean this in a durrogator fashion - it's just a fact that all people starting out in serious photography have a lot to learn - it's something we all go through and continue to go through)..

pj1974 Nov 13, 2006 7:45 AM

Sacstella, I say "Amen" to what JohnG wrote!

He's summed it up well.If you said in your first post you want to stick with Nikon and Canon (staying with these 2 is a sort of a good idea anyway because they have the best range of lenses....) ... then go with either the Nikon D80 (or D50 which is also available) or the Canon 400XTi (or 350XT which is still available) and you'll be set to START!

Practise. enjoy. In time choose lenses you realise will help the type / style of photography you're into (or WANT to get into). Too many people spend more time analysing photography equipment than USING it!

Don't over analyse or worry about differences, apart from maybe looking / feeling how the camera works for you (in your hand, with your eyes / glasses, etc). Ergonomics can be much more personal / subjective and important for one person than another.

Best wishes

Paul

BenjaminXYZ Nov 13, 2006 7:51 AM

Quote:


Let me take a crack at restating what Ben is saying - virtually every DSLR on the market is great and has great features.

Yes, you got it right. But instead of just stating that boring statement ""All dSLR cameras are great" I decided to state why are they great. (I decided to include details)

Quote:


But I caution against getting caught up in analysis paralysis - that is, considering so many cameras and reading so many reviews that you never end up buying a camera.


Don't worry, I would be getting my dSLR camera soon; and wouldn't have been able to come this far, if I had not perform my research.

Quote:


If you've narrowed it down (for whatever reasons) to a couple models - stick with those. Hand hold those and see which you like.

So far, he or she had not provided us with his or her criteria(s). (Yet)

Quote:


You could spend months and months reading reviews and get caught up in marketing babble and new features that, in the end, aren't going to make as much difference as the glass you use AND, most importantly, the hands-on practice you can get by actually buying and using the camera.


Yeah, but isn't is just "Better" to research and see which model(s) fits your criteria(s)better. (Or perhaps "even"fits thebest?)

Quote:


I gaurantee you'r skill will be the limiting factor - far more so than the camera body (and I don't mean this in a durrogator fashion - it's just a fact that all people starting out in serious photography have a lot to learn - it's something we all go through and continue to go through)..


Yeah, all this would happen regardless of whatever dSLR camerabody you get...So might as well get the best one for you? (The one that suits you?)









BenjaminXYZ Nov 13, 2006 7:57 AM

Quote:


Practise. enjoy. In time choose lenses you realise will help the type / style of photography you're into (or WANT to get into). Too many people spend more time analysing photography equipment than USING it!

Yeah, I can still enjoy, practice, and choose lenses EVENafter I have choosen the most suitable dSLR camera body. ;)I can still use the dSLR body that I have carefully choosen; for great photography too. :idea:

Quote:


Don't over analyse or worry about differences, apart from maybe looking / feeling how the camera works for you (in your hand, with your eyes / glasses, etc). Ergonomics can be much more personal / subjective and important for one person than another.


All the more you are trying justifymy point; that we allneed to perform our research (To Tailor forour criteria(s)). ;):idea:



JohnG Nov 13, 2006 8:22 AM

Ben,

Research the original post, the criteria is there...



sacstella wrote:
Quote:

I want a digital SLR to use as way of a new hobby, (with professional potential.)
My subjects will mainly be people. I may want to use this camera at weddings/birthdays/concerts/family photos/headshots- when making a suggestion, please take this into consideration.



So rather than regurgitate specs and reviews, I felt it beneficial to give advice tailored to the OPs stated needs. I just don't find regurgitated data useful - in fact, it can be counter-productive. The point is to recognize what camera features are necessary for the work the OP wants to do: weddings/birthdays/concerts/family photos / headshots.

We all understand you like to regurgitate review data. For that to be useful, however, YOU need to sift through the data and provide the relevent info. The reality is: given the right LENSES and experience any of the DSLRs in question will meet the needs. But, it doesn't matter which camera body the OP gets. If they don't get the right lenses and accessories they're not going to get great results at weadings/ concerts / headshots.

That is a continued point you refuse to accept. Photography is so much more than the camera body. Sometimes specific camera features are important and sometimes they're not. Sometimes specific lenses are important and sometimes they're not.

In this case those lenses and accessories are more important than the body for some of the stated purposes.

Quote:

All the more you are trying justifymy point; that we allneed to perform our research (To Tailor forour criteria(s)). ;):idea:
Ben, again you miss the point - there is a difference between doing good analysis and doing too much analysis. You've spent months bouncing back and forth between every major brand and just about every model of camera out there. Compared to other people who made a purchase and are actually taking photographs with their camera and learning. Your other posts bear out that you still have a lot to learn about photography (and there's no shame in that whatsoever). Time is better spent learning and practicing PHOTOGRAPHY. Not learning and reading about the technology. Reading about sensors and such isn't going to help you as a photographer - it just isn't.

But, back to this thread - according to the OPs stated criteria, any of the cameras being considered is fine - just realize that skill and lenses will be the limiting factors for some of the goals.

BenjaminXYZ Nov 13, 2006 8:32 AM

JohnG,

I didn't see the criteria(s), so I am sorry about that.

I agree lenses play a VERY IMPORTANT ROLE in photography, than the camera body.


For my case, I would bring it one step further; and say that the image sensor + lens combination plays the most important role of all.

Larger photo-sites.

Large aperture lenses.

High ISO performance.

More signal; less noise.

Low sensor noise; low noise reduction.


However, keep in mind that I meant all this to apply to myself only, not tothe O.P.. (So pleasedon't jump on me!)




Wirraway Nov 13, 2006 9:47 AM

And here you were Ben you had to ask what stops were abouta shortwhile ago, IMHO you have got a hide giving adviceto people asking what DSLR to buy, leave it to experianced people like John G, Jim C and others that have EXPERIENCE with these cameras, your still young and wet behind the ears and have plenty to learn, including manners. just my 2 cents.





BenjaminXYZ Nov 13, 2006 10:11 AM

Quote:


And here you were Ben you had to ask what stops were abouta shortwhile ago, IMHO you have got a hide giving adviceto people asking what DSLR to buy, leave it to experianced people like John G, Jim C and others that have EXPERIENCE with these cameras, your still young and wet behind the ears and have plenty to learn, including manners. just my 2 cents.






Since when did I asked about stops??? Since when I did not know about stops???

What doyoumean thatI got a hide??? :?Please, If you want yourselfto be respected and received,please make considerable effort(s) to improve yourEnglish writing communication standard(s)beforeYOU requestafavor from me!

I DO think that you need to IMPROVE your communication skills for the start.

Regards.

---


BTW, it seems that you have edited your message and still got it all wrong. (Don't try to tell me what to do whenYOU for the start, can't even get your message across properly!)

I am wet behind the ears??? Excuse me, what sort of English are you speaking? (I needto ask myChinese teacher to teach you speak proper English!)

If you need to tell me something,PLEASE express it in proper standard English! (If you want to get your message across, do it properly)



Quote:


And here you were Ben you had to ask what stops were abouta shortwhile ago, IMHO you have got a hide giving adviceto people asking what DSLR to buy, leave it to experianced people like John G, Jim C and others that have EXPERIENCE with these cameras, your still young and wet behind the ears and have plenty to learn, including manners. just my 2 cents.








Last edited on Mon Nov 13th, 2006 11:50 pm by Wirraway


JohnG Nov 13, 2006 11:23 AM

Can we get back to the original topic? Please take any any information or posts not relevent to the OP and start another thread. No need to further hijack this one.

sacstella,

Please let us know if you require any further information or assistance in your decision process.



sacstella Nov 14, 2006 12:13 AM

:cool: Thanks everyone- The information here is helpful. I will be able to narrow my search and come close to making a purchase in no time.

I am not too sure what happened with all the hootin' back and fourth. But I am able to read between the lines, (the important stuff). I've found this forum thing to be interesting. This was my first post EVER! Haha.

Thanks for the experience. :-)

What do I do now? Now that the thread has seemed to be restarted? Guess I'll look for you same helpfuls elsewhere. I've got plenty of questions brewing!!

CHEERS!

S--


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 8:56 AM.