Go Back   Steve's Digicams Forums > Digicam Help > What Camera Should I Buy?

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Nov 29, 2007, 8:40 PM   #11
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 32
Default

MtClimber, I've read many of your other posts here, and actually your information is what got me looking at this cam in the first place. I see you are an instructor, and you have used many digital cams.

How would you compare this to the Pentax D10 / D100? On paper one would think that the larger sensor would give better performance as far as noise for a given iso, but reviews I have read and even actual posts from users in the Pentax slr forum seem to indicate that it is pretty much a draw.

Perhaps the reviewer that had problems with low light focus had a bad cam? I don't know, I've read at least half a dozen reviews on this cam and that was the only mention of low light focus problems. I still think I would prefer manual focus on the lens instead of pushing a button.

Also MtClimber if you would, can you give a comparison of any experience you have had comparing this cam to a Nikon D40/x, or even a D80. I could spring for a D80 if the indoor low light performance was a lot better, but I just have to believe that the IS on the D510 helps out by being able to use slower shutter speeds.

Any help is appreciated!


dmiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 29, 2007, 9:40 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
mtclimber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 18,143
Default

dmiles-

There is indeed a huge problem with the misstating of camera models. Let's try to untangle this, if we can, please. When referring, DMILES, to the Pentax brand, are you perhaps referring to the K-10, in place of your OWN PERSONAL nomenclature of "D-10/D-100?"

If we get that straightened out, then we can move forward. So please tell us if my assumptions are correct.

Sarah Joyce
mtclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 29, 2007, 10:20 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
mtngal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Frazier Park, CA
Posts: 16,056
Default

I haven't used the Oly, but all dSLR cameras use similar technology to auto focus - they all use sensors that require contrast to focus. Some cameras are a little faster or a little more accurate, but any of them will hunt for a focus when faced with a smooth, featurelesssurface or a black room without using something like an AF assist light (normally on the flash). If you bear this in mind when you are focusing the camera, you shouldn't have much problem. Interesting about their manual focus method - I haven't really looked at one so didn't realize you didn't manually focus with the lens (half of my every-day lenses are manual focus, it would be odd not to focus this way).
mtngal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 29, 2007, 10:26 PM   #14
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 32
Default

mtclimber wrote:
Quote:
dmiles-

There is indeed a huge problem with the misstating of camera models. Let's try to untangle this, if we can, please. When referring, DMILES, to the Pentax brand, are you perhaps referring to the K-10, in place of your OWN PERSONAL nomenclature of "D-10/D-100?"

If we get that straightened out, then we can move forward. So please tell us if my assumptions are correct.

Sarah Joyce
Yes I meant K10 / K100 for the Pentax. Thanks.
dmiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 29, 2007, 10:40 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
mtclimber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 18,143
Default

dmiles-

I will attempt to catch up with your question in the next few day. Right now I have to hop in the car and head out to complete a contract. I hope you will understand.

Sarah Joyce
mtclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 29, 2007, 10:51 PM   #16
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 32
Default

mtclimber wrote:
Quote:
dmiles-

I will attempt to catch up with your question in the next few day. Right now I have to hop in the car and head out to complete a contract. I hope you will understand.

Sarah Joyce
Sure thing Sarah...I will look forward to it! Thanks again.
dmiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 30, 2007, 8:59 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
mtngal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Frazier Park, CA
Posts: 16,056
Default

I would NOT recommend the K10given your situation (and I use both Pentax cameras), but not because of the noise issue (the K10 is noisier than the K100, but it isn't all that bad).

Your original post said that the camera would be used fairly often byyour non-tech petite wife. I share your petite wife's stature, and find I sometimes struggle with the heavy weight of the K10. It's also has lots of buttons and levers on the outside of the camera, allowing the user to change various settings easily. But that's a double edged sword - it is easy to accidentally change (or forget to change)something and discover that those priceless shots were taken at the wrong setting and worthless. The K100 is lighter with some of the same controls in a menu, which means you have to deliberately change them. I find it easier and more comfortable to shoot with for quick shots (less likely to have them messed up due to operator mistakes).

I happen to really like the K100, but it is also larger and heavier than the Oly. I would highly recommend that you and your wife go and actually handle both cameras before you buy anything.
mtngal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 30, 2007, 9:12 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
mtclimber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 18,143
Default

mtngal raises so excellent points. Noise which occurs at higher ISO settings is a function of pixel density. When you use the same size CMOS imager and increase the pixel count from 6mp (for the K-100) to 10mp (for the K-10) you have physically increased the pixel density on the cmos imager: the result is more noise.

This happens with the K-100 versus the K-10 and on the Nikon D-40 versus the D-40X. Therefore you might say this is one of the prices to be paid when the pixel count increases on the same exact size cmos chip.

Sarah Joyce
mtclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 30, 2007, 11:21 AM   #19
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 32
Default

All valid points by mt gal and climber, and much appreciated. I totally understand the physics behind smaller sensor + more pixels = more noise. Given that, one would think the 510 with the smallest sensor and 10 megapixels would be off the charts with noise. But when I read the in depth review at dpreview, they actually suggest turning NR off with a sharpness setting of -2, at least up toiso 400.

Also, the posts I read from users in the Pentax and OlympusSLR forums seems to suggest that the difference in noise is so small as to be a non-issue.

Suggestions are well taken, I understand the local CC has a 410, a Nikon D40/x, and the Cannon Xt/Xti on display for us to try. Not sure about the Penatx, but we will be going for a test drive tonight or tomorrow at the latest.

Thanks again for all the help. I lean strongly to the Oly for several reasons, but have no problems with Penatx as my second 35mm SLR was an ME Super (yes I'm that old) that served me well for years, in fact I still have it and it still works like the day I bought it some 25 years ago.


dmiles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Nov 30, 2007, 11:31 AM   #20
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 8,529
Default

dmiles wrote:
Quote:
John,

Excellent shots, so much better than we have been able to get with our little Fuji F11. What camera do you use? I read still another review of the 510 that stressed how much trouble it has auto focusing in low light. That is a show stopper for me. I have had cameras in the past that have this problem.
I shoot with Canon cameras. A couple of these are with a 20d and some with 1dmkIII. I use a sigma 500dg super flash - bounced when possible, on a flash bracket when not possible. Bouncing gives much more natural lighting without harsh shadows. The bracket moves the flash further away eliminating red eye.

As to focusing in low light. Contrary to another post - NOT ALL cameras are created equal in this regard. Sony for instance does VERY well focusing in low light. The old Canon 10d focused better in low light than the 20d or 30d. So, one camera model can absolutely focus better in low light than another.

Now, ANY camera will be aided by using a lens with a wider aperture. The camera always focuses with the aperture wide open. So a 1.8 lens always focuses at 1.8 - then closes down when the exposure is taken. So, any camera will focus better with a 2.0 lens than a 2.8 lens because the camera has twice the light with which to focus.

AND, if you're using flash - that's the benefiit of a focus assist beam. On external flashes it emits usually a red light (less annoying) to aid in the focusing. So you're able to get good focus with a 5.6 lens.

Glad to hear you're going to handle all the cameras being considered. That will very likely remove a camera or two from consideration - making your choice easier.
JohnG is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 7:42 AM.