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Old Dec 31, 2007, 7:33 AM   #11
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BeyondPeru wrote:
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No, not from Peru, but from the UK.I once had a fantastic adventure trekking across Peru.

The Canon S5 IS ticks nearly all of the boxes, but I'm still not happy with a couple of issues:

1) The wide angle is only an equivalent of 36mm. When you compare this to 28mm many other digicams offer, you're left wishing you could get a little closer when taking group shots and a little more of the picture when taking landscape scenes. And I really don't want to fork out $100 for the wide angle attachment, then have the bother of attaching/removing it on a regular basis. I would much rather lose a little off the telephoto end and gain it at wide angle.

2) The small sensor just doesn't cut the mustard. Check out the Canon S5 IS sample photos on the PhotographyBlog web site (click on Reviews, then scroll down to Canon Powershot S5 IS19th September 2007, or click here: Canon Powershot S5 IS). Examine a few of the 100% views. They've not been touched up, and some of them leave a lot to be desired. They look ok on my small laptop display, but on my 19" LCDscreen I see plenty of noise, chromatic abberation, and some of them aren't even in focus. Check out the one with two women sittingtogether. I'd be really disappointed if I had taken that.

I'm taking my family to Disney in six weeks, and I'd like to pick up a replacement for my old 4mp Minolta so I can get good pictures and record movie clips. I suspect I'll be better off buying a small compact to tide me over, then buying my ideal camera if/whenany of the majormanufacturers get their act together later this year. May be I'm out on a limb here. Perhaps their research suggests they've already nailed the perfect camera. Perhaps I should be willing to settle for "almost".
I totally disagree with #2... The key is knowing what the limitations are... I get great results (at least they are great to me, which is the most important thing!), but then I very rarely take my S5 off of ISO 80... If need be I use the flash or tripod... of if I have to i will go up to ISO 200... but never above that... But if I really have to use the higher ISO I know I can clean up a the noise using Neat Image...

Ok.. here are my samples... i don't remember all the details... yes they've been adjusted with PS.. but i guess my feeling is so what... i've very happy with the finished image... LOL!








To me these images are very acceptable... can I get better picture quality out of my 20D? Sure... but if I had to hike around Disney world for hours on end would I rather carry my 20D and multiple lens... or the S5?? I'm willing to trade off some picture quailty for the convince of the S5...

Oh and I don't have any sample videos handy, but the S5 video quality is actually quite surprising!
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Old Dec 31, 2007, 7:48 AM   #12
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I admit, at the resolution shown, those ARE good images. I'd certainly be happy with them. I understand the need to keep the ISO low.

You've won me over, almost. But every time I want tocapture a landscape scene, I'll be thinking "I wish I could get just a little more wide-angle", 28mm is so much better. And the extra 6x zoom of the competitor 18x lenses at the telephoto end would be lovely to have too. Sheesh! I am my own worst enemy.

Thanks, though. I think the Canon S5 IS is a better compromise than the Panasonic Z18.
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Old Dec 31, 2007, 7:49 AM   #13
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peripatetic wrote:
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Examine a few of the 100% views. They've not been touched up, and some of them leave a lot to be desired.
You realise that at 100% you are looking at the print equivalent of about a 3 feet wide image from a distance of a few inches?

Here's the thing: all small sensor cameras have rubbish high-ISO performance. Comparing them to each other is basically just a comparison of the noise reduction algorithms in use. Model A is grotesque, whereas model B is merely revolting. These cameras have to be used at ISO 100 or below.

So use a tripod or a flash in low light.

Moving past that I agree that a wide angle end for the zoom is very important. That only leaves you with two manufacturers of superzooms with 28mm equivalent, Ricoh or Panasonic.

The obvious choice is the pana FZ18.
while it may not be the most optimal thing... you can add a wide angle lens to the S5... it is a .75x ( i think) which take the S5 wide angle to a 27mm equivalent... so a hair wider than the 28mm you mentioned...


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Old Dec 31, 2007, 7:56 AM   #14
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BeyondPeru wrote:
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I admit, at the resolution shown, those ARE good images. I'd certainly be happy with them. I understand the need to keep the ISO low.

You've won me over, almost. But every time I want tocapture a landscape scene, I'll be thinking "I wish I could get just a little more wide-angle", 28mm is so much better. And the extra 6x zoom of the competitor 18x lenses at the telephoto end would be lovely to have too. Sheesh! I am my own worst enemy.

Thanks, though. I think the Canon S5 IS is a better compromise than the Panasonic Z18.
As i mentioned in my other post, there are add-on lens for the S5... may not be the most optimal/handy solution but it is an option... the wide angle is a .75x (so you end up with a 27mm equiv at the wide end) and the tele-add-on is a 1.5x (so you end up with a 648mm equiv on the tele end)...

I completely understand when you say you are your own worst enemy! Some days I'm like that too! Maybe i'll try to get some sample video with the S5 and see if that can push you over the edge! LOL!
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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:00 AM   #15
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You're right, but it's likely to become a little irritating to have to add/remove the wide angle attachment AND there's also the extra telephoto option, when the competitor 18x lenses offer the extra flexibility at both ends already. One of the benefits of the fixed lens over the SLRs is that you don't need to bother with swapping lenses.

What's more, the wide angle lens is very expesive in relation to the purchase price of the camera. I think I'd rather just put up with it.
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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:19 AM   #16
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Ok... i do have one sample video... it is not very good... BUT the story behind it is actually more telling than the video quality itself...

So we were decorating the christmas tree with our 3 year old... i was just taking some snapshots with the S5. Our living room is pretty dark so this is a low light situation... Well, my daughter is getting all excited about the tree and christmas... i'm snapping away... when all of a sudden she starts kissing the ornaments! Well, i have never used my S5 for video but I didn't want to ruin the momemt by going tryin go find my good Sony camcorder...

So i used the S5.... that is the very handy feature of the S5... instand video recording! Just hit the big video recording button and the S5 will start capturing video! No need to switch to a video capture mode! Now as i mentioned this is a low light video, it has been compressed into WMV and is only about 5MB. So the quality is not the best but the most important thing to me is I was able to capture the moment! If I had been shooting with the 20D I would have missed this...

I don't know how to embed videos.. so i'll just do it this way... here's a link... right click to download/save as... as i mentioned it's about 5MB...

http://www.v6john.com/Main/Videos/gi..._ornaments.wmv

I will try to get some outdoors/good lighting video (with zooming! LOL)


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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:26 AM   #17
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Right, I'm convinced. Thank you for your movie clip. It is very small for the duration. Could it be that you recorded it at 15 frames/sec.

I found another clip, which, while rather hefty at 61MB for 31 seconds, is not altogether unreasonable for 640x480 at 30 frames/sec. It also demonstrates subtle use of the zoom. The video link is at the bottom of the following page:

http://www.photographyblog.com/revie...ot_s5_is_3.php

I confess, I was rather put off by the stills shown on that page, but perhaps they were all taken with a high ISO level, or by a partially sighted person with parkinson's disease.

I really think I'm sold on the Canon. I can't thank y'all enough.


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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:44 AM   #18
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Beyond,

It doesn't have a twisty, swiveling LCD (very few cameras do), it doesn't have IS (works fine without it), it doesn't have 8MP (maybe that's the problem with the other cameras), and it isn't even a current model (although still available, and with a $50 mail in rebate)...

...but it does have a 1/1.7" sensor, you can zoom while taking video (with a manual zoom ring), it has face detection, it has more than a 10x zoom range - beginning at 28mm, and it uses AA batteries...

...AND it has much better image quality at ISO's above 100 than some of the cameras suggested herein. Yes, all of these other cameras will take great, awesome pictures outdoors on a nice sunny day, if you keep the ISO at or below 100. But don't be so naive to believe you can take great ISO 100 pics while sitting inside a moving vehicle, as you traverse a winding course inside "It's a Small World". And the people crammed in the vehicle on either side of you may object to your attempts to implant a tripod leg in their groin. Twisting, swiveling LCD's won't help here...IS won't help here - the subjects are moving as well as you...8MP won't help here - neither will 10 or 12 MP. Sometimes there is no substitution for high ISO performance...bet you can think of some more.

And how about video performance? Would that be any better in low light, if the still picture performance is sub-par?

Good luck with your choice.

the Hun

(Fuji S6000fd)
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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:55 AM   #19
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BeyondPeru wrote:
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Right, I'm convinced. Thank you for your movie clip. It is very small for the duration. Could it be that you recorded it at 15 frames/sec.

I found another clip, which, while rather hefty at 61MB for 31 seconds, is not altogether unreasonable for 640x480 at 30 frames/sec. It also demonstrates subtle use of the zoom. The video link is at the bottom of the following page:

http://www.photographyblog.com/revie...ot_s5_is_3.php

I confess, I was rather put off by the stills shown on that page, but perhaps they were all taken with a high ISO level, or by a partially sighted person with parkinson's disease.

I really think I'm sold on the Canon. I can't thank y'all enough.

Ok... I checked out the sample page... I looked at the squirrel picture... OMG, was that terrible! But as you suspected it was shot at ISO-800!! Also looks like the camera focused on the leaves just behind the squirrel... which of course can happen with any AF camera... none of them are 100%... I just don't think it's a very good example to post! LOL! And I knew before I bought my S5 I would never use the higher ISO settings...

Now the video... that looked good! But then again that's a 60MB AVI file for 30 seconds of video... my sample is 42 seconds and only 5 MB... think mines compressed a bit more! LOL! I'll try and get a better sample video for future reference..


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Old Dec 31, 2007, 8:56 AM   #20
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I don't think I understand which camera you are referring to, rinniethehun. If you check the specs of the Canon PowerShot S5 IS on this site: http://www.steves-digicams.co.uk/200...anon_s5is.html, it clearly documents its features.

Are you referring to another model?


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