Go Back   Steve's Digicams Forums > Digicam Help > What Camera Should I Buy?

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Dec 9, 2009, 8:24 AM   #21
Senior Member
 
shoturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Frankfurt AM
Posts: 11,348
Default

I have the ef-s 18-55mm I use for running around and traveling as it is very light which is pretty good for that purpose, but my ef 28-135mm IS is sharper then the ef-s lens, it is the luck of the draw i guess with the the ef-s lens. Both are good lenses.

My EF 70-300mm IS is new for 550 the equivalent pentax 55-300mm for 300, so a 200 bucks different is allot so you are paying a premium for the added IS lens. I also have the ef-s 55-250mm which I use for traveling again it is a light lens, but I do notice more distortion as you get close to the 250mm range, while my 70-300mm has less distortion at 300mm range compare to the 55-250 at max range. So middle quality IS lenses are more expensive then mid level non IS lenes.

Granted IS in the body may not be as good as IS in the lens, but no matter what lens you use with IS in the body, you have IS. Not all canon lens or Nikon lens have IS, so if you use a non IS lens you do not have the benefit of IS. And Canon has way more lenses to chose from. But with the pentax, you can use any AF lens they have made since they started making AF lenses with the K-X, even if the lens is 30 years old. Which is cool for pentaxian's. Granted the canon has more steps in the lens progression then pentax, with canon you go from 250 bucks to 550 buck to well over 1500 bucks for a long range telephoto, pentax goes form 350 to 1500 with out the middle step.

I agree the build quality of the pentax kit lenses seem to be higher then the canon ef-s lenses. So with the pentax you do get more bang for the bucks with features to cost. It does take really nice pictures.

Last edited by shoturtle; Dec 10, 2009 at 11:03 PM.
shoturtle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 8:44 AM   #22
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 8,529
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shoturtle View Post
My EF 70-300mm IS is new for 550 the equivalent pentax 55-300mm for 300, so a 200 bucks different is allot so you are paying a premium for the added IS lens.
You have to be careful generalizing comparisons. The two lenses are comparative in focal coverage. BUT, there are some differences. The pentax lens has no focus motor - it relies on the screw drive of the camera and will be slower to focus than the USM driven Canon lens. Now, that may not matter - depending on what you shoot - but it is another difference. So, the $200 isn't just for IS, you're getting the focus motor too. If you shoot moving wildlife or sports you'll appreciate the benefit of focus motor in the lens - just ask any Pentaxian that has used a Sigma HSM lens.

So, how much do you have to pay for a Pentax lens of 300mm with a focus motor to improve the focus performance?
JohnG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 8:48 AM   #23
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 8,529
Default

By the way, not all Canon USM lenses are created equal either. The 70-300 has micro USM - better than non-USM but not as good as Ring USM used in say the 70-200 f4 ($600) or the 70-300 DO ($1100) or most of the L lenses.
JohnG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 9:47 AM   #24
Senior Member
 
shoturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Frankfurt AM
Posts: 11,348
Default

I am very well aware of that, they are not all equal. It comes down to how much you want to pay for the features. I love canon cameras and lens, but they are pricey when you get to the DO and L lenses.

The pentax kit lenses are pretty much par with the Canon lenses kit offering in performance imho. Just that Canon has more steps and options as oppose to pentax. But does everyone need a DO or L lenses?

But I think the op was asking about the kits, and imho the pentax kit is equal to the canon on lens quality and performance, the pentax without a doubt has more features built in, while the canon you will need to invest in apple aperture or photoshop to do the same basic processing. Some people may not want to spend the time with these programs, and want the effect out the box. And that is one thing that the pentax offer.
shoturtle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 9:53 AM   #25
Senior Member
 
shoturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Frankfurt AM
Posts: 11,348
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnG View Post
You have to be careful generalizing comparisons. The two lenses are comparative in focal coverage. BUT, there are some differences. The pentax lens has no focus motor - it relies on the screw drive of the camera and will be slower to focus than the USM driven Canon lens. Now, that may not matter - depending on what you shoot - but it is another difference. So, the $200 isn't just for IS, you're getting the focus motor too. If you shoot moving wildlife or sports you'll appreciate the benefit of focus motor in the lens - just ask any Pentaxian that has used a Sigma HSM lens.

So, how much do you have to pay for a Pentax lens of 300mm with a focus motor to improve the focus performance?
Yes the ef 70-300 is not ring mounted, and honestly it is not much quicker the my ef-s 55-250 in focusing because of this. To me the USM is a moot point when comparing the usm benefits because of the this. Because it is really not that much quicker.

If I wanted the speed of the USM I would get the EF 70-300 ID DO len. But 550 vs 1200, is it worth it to me. Not really.
shoturtle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 10:51 AM   #26
Moderator
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Posts: 8,529
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by shoturtle View Post
Yes the ef 70-300 is not ring mounted, and honestly it is not much quicker the my ef-s 55-250 in focusing because of this. .
Do you shoot action wildlife or sports? The reason I ask is because that is where the benefits are most noticable. Which, of course, is why I said "depending on what you shoot".

But the point is - you said the lenses were comparable and Optically they are. But focus speed wise they are not. You want to include image stabilization in the discussion but you want to exclude focus motor. Either you compare apples to apples or you don't. The reality is, it's almost impossible to compare apples to apples. What's important is to understand the attributes of various cameras/lenses and determine whether or not they are important FOR THE SPECIFIC PHOTOGRAPHER. For example, I use a 70-200 2.8 lens. For my specific needs, IS isn't really beneficial. So I have the non-IS canon version. For some shooters, IS in that focal length is beneficial.

So, in a Canon vs. Pentax comparison you have to consider differences. For example, Canon is selling t1i and kit plus 55-250 with $200 reduction - you get the 55-250 for $50. A person wanting to step up to a better lens has the next choice of 70-300 IS USM or 70-200 f4 (non-IS). They can decide what they benefit more from - 300mm of good consumer optics and IS or 200mm of professional optics and professional build and professional focus speed. Depending on the individual shooter any of the 3 lenses is a possible choice.

You have to be careful that you don't bias your decision on YOUR needs. You don't value Ring USM - but another shooter might value that over reach and choose the 70-200 f4 over the 70-300. Or they may value build quality or optical quality. While another person may value reach at a reasonable price.

I agree the kits are very comparable but you went past the kits and started talking about other lenses and made some claims that Pentax lenses were more affordable and you had to pay more to get comparable canon lenses with IS. There is an inherant issue with that statement in that YOU are requiring one feature - image stabilization - but ignoring another - focus motor. And, of course, ignoring other lenses like the 70-200 f4 which has trade-offs and can be a better choice for some shooters than a 70-300.

So, you indicated your 55-250 focuses about as fast as your 70-300, so let me ask again - do you shoot sports or moving wildlife (e.g. birds in flight) where the focus speed differences are more noticable?

Don't get me wrong - I think Pentax is an outstanding system and the KX is a great kit. But I think your comparisons are a bit overly simplistic because they focus on 2 attributes only.

I bring this all up because I have IS and non-IS lenses. And I firmly believe anti-shake is good for some purposes and not useful for others. Like megapixels it is one of the most overrated features. But the market wants it so manufacturers give it. Similarly, ISO 6400 ability. Some people benefit from it but others don't need it.

So, what we know is the OP wanted a kit. Both pentax and Canon had comparable kits. Once you move beyond kits into other lenses I'd be very careful indicating anti-shake is a requirement - it isn't. Any more than 15mp in the camera body is a requirement or ISO 6400 is a requirement.

Again, if you'd like an example - Canon's 70-200 f4 (non IS). What comparable lens is there in Pentax? Or Canon's 70-200 2.8? Or the 135 2.0? or 85mm 1.8? or plenty of other lenses with plenty of useful features if anti-shake is not a photographer's requirment?
JohnG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 9, 2009, 4:11 PM   #27
Senior Member
 
shoturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Frankfurt AM
Posts: 11,348
Default

the kit lens are from the kit are equal. The canon EF-S lenses are equal to the pentax it pretty much in everything, the are equally loud and fast.

As I shoot landscape mostly, some action. And I have good results with my ef-s 55-250, but the ef 70-300mm is just a bit faster. I have used a ef 70-300mm IS DO USM, and that was way faster.
shoturtle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 18, 2009, 1:30 PM   #28
Senior Member
 
guillermovilas's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Hasselt , Belgium
Posts: 794
Default

Canon or Nikon body , for the lens choice
guillermovilas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 19, 2009, 12:38 AM   #29
Senior Member
 
shoturtle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Frankfurt AM
Posts: 11,348
Default

which nikon body, the whole canon rebel line will accept all canon, while the d5000 will only accept af-s lenses. The d90 will accept all nikon lenses, but it is much more expensive the the d5000.
shoturtle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Dec 19, 2009, 11:34 AM   #30
Senior Member
 
mtclimber's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Oregon, USA
Posts: 18,143
Default

Whoa!

The thread is on post #29 and the OP has not been involved since post #11, I personally think that the OP is not being served very well.

Sarah Joyce
mtclimber is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 5:13 PM.