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Old Feb 22, 2010, 5:21 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chato View Post
Note the qualifier.

No, the DX series was specifically designed to "correct" for the cropping factor when used with a 1.5 crop camera. To cover themselves, their newer FF sensors simply turn off the outer edge of the sensor, and the lens will now have the same cropping effect as a normal lens.

Their not to clear in their writing - probably DELIBERATELY not to clear, but on a different lens, it's easier to understand...


Nikon | Imaging Products | AF-S DX NIKKOR 10-24mm f/3.5-4.5G ED

Dave
We are debating semantics. Since the OP is well aware of SLR focal range. The 18mm of the DX lens equals the same view a 28mm on a film slr. And if he pops a 28mm on a crop nikon body, it would look really different from what he is accustom to.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 6:34 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoturtle View Post
We are debating semantics. Since the OP is well aware of SLR focal range. The 18mm of the DX lens equals the same view a 28mm on a film slr. And if he pops a 28mm on a crop nikon body, it would look really different from what he is accustom to.
Not at all. If he uses this lens on a 1.5 sensor he will indeed be getting 18-55.

Re-read the link I posted
"DX-format, ultra wide-angle 2.4x zoom lens with focal length ranging from 10 to 24mm (picture angle is equivalent to a focal length of 15 to 36mm in FX- and 35mm formats)"

This was Nikons bid to sell DX lenses after the cease making 1.5 sensors.

It's not semantics at all. You can do a search on the Net to confirm this...

Dave
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 6:55 PM   #33
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the d5000, d3000, d90 are all 1.5 crop body camera. I guess I am not understanding you. Or you are not understanding what the OP is asking.

because from my reading, if you put a 10-24 onto any one of these nikon, you have the aspect of 15-36mm. To get the 10-24 mm prospect you will need to put it on a full frame.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 7:24 PM   #34
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Hi folks - I'm back!

Just to check it all... The lens above says 10-24mm (real) and 15-36mm in 35mm equivalent - so using it on a 1.5x camera I'll have the same effect of 15-36 in a film camera... I think it is clear.

The same way the lens I pointed in the beginnig, 28-300mm from Sigma, will result in a 42-450mm equivalent in a 1.5x camera like Pentax K-X - so if I use it I would se a very much more restrict field of view than the one I used to see in my old 28mm film camera. As Chato said, it WILL BE a 28mm, but will not give me the effect I was waiting from a 28mm...

And finally, if I want to have the same 28mm view that I used to have, I'll need the 18-200mm that will give a field of view (or angle of view) equivalent to the 28-300mm in the film camera.

It's really about semantics. As the effetive field of view changes with the size of sensor, and this angle is in practice measured by the field of view as a tradition between photographers, its necessary to have a "standard", and this standard is the 35mm film, even being unused these days...

My original doubt was exactly about this point of reference. I thought that a lens to APS-C lenses "could" have it's focal distance already converted to it's 1.6x or 1.5x factor, when no oposite information was provided, but it's clear observing other models and manufacturers that the focal distance is ALWAYS the real one for 35mm film and must be converted before interpreted, and we realize that the "converted" focal distance is always expressed in "35mm EQUIVALENT".

Example that started the confusion:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/389312-REG/Sigma_795109_28_300mm_f_3_5_6_3_DG_Macro.html#feat ures
This lens does not mention the equivalent because it is a lens directed to film SLR or fulf size dSLR. If using it in a APS-C dSLR we will have the cropping and will obtain 42-450mm equivalent

Example that makes it clear:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/363592-REG/Tamron_AF014P700_18_200mm_f_3_5_6_3_XR_Di_II.html, #features
In this case the shop talks about the equivalent focal distance and also call attention to the fact that this lens is not just a 18-200mm, but has it's image size restricted to APS-C sensor, causing huge borders or resolution loss if used in film cameras.

And this is usefull to do realize these differences:
http://www.tamron.com/lenses/learning_center/tools/focal-length-comparison.php

(at the end the discussions became crossed - we discussing crop here and dSLR options in the other topic)

Thansk people - I learnt a lot with all this debate about cropping! And some more tips about dSLRs and Prosumer cameras are still welcome!

Last edited by MarceloRSC; Feb 22, 2010 at 7:27 PM.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 7:28 PM   #35
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Actually 35mm standard is still in uses with Full Frame DSLR. Like the Canon 5DMKII just as an example.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 7:50 PM   #36
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Dave,

I just check the DX lens. It will fit on a nikon FX body. But if you try to shoot a DX lens on FF setting, it does something funky. You black out the sides of the photo. To have the DX lens work properly with a FX body. You need to set the sensor to 1.5 crop. So even with the DX lens on a FX body you need to apply the crop factor. 10-24mm DX is still 15-36mm on a FF body because you need to crop the sensor.

If you go to ken rockwell's site and do a search on the DX lens, it will show you the funky photo with the DX lens with the sensor at full frame. It is kinda cool actually.

Here is the photo of the DX on a FF sensor.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/dx-lenses.htm
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 8:31 PM   #37
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About full frame cameras, should I include them in my camera search? If APS-C is very better than 1/2.33" sensors, a full 35mm is expected to be awesome in low light sensitivity...

But are these 35mm full frame actually old cameras, sold before the new formats rised, and possibly despite the size have worse results, OR they are professional cameras in another level of price?
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 8:41 PM   #38
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If you want to spend 2000 dollar and up. They are really expensive. The cheapest Sony A900 is still very expensive if you are not a completely into photography as a hobby or career. I have been shooting slr for over 20 years. And I would not get a full frame, I do not shoot enough of print big enough to require a full frame camera.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 8:41 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarceloRSC View Post
... OR they are professional cameras in another level of price?
That.
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Old Feb 22, 2010, 8:42 PM   #40
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Very intersting image!

I can notice that the APS-C becoming a "standard", brought new horizons to lens manufacturers. The first SLRs used full lenses to 35mm, a larger sensor - then when the smaller sensors came, these lens ware still used, but with extra glasses and sizes that ware unuseful... And the manufacturers discovered that they do not need to provide all that diameter to APS-C, and could provide more powerfull lenses in the same size.

An example is the 18-250mm - to make a 18mm until 250mm in film size the size of the lens should be very larger than these we see... The old 28-200m I had in film is very larger than these...

About cropping, as you told, does the full frame cameras have this function built-in, to allow to use these lens, cropping the central image and working with part of the sensor area, making this cropped area full size in framing and generated file? Actually it is discarding part of it's resolution, right?

And of course if cropping it will convert a 28mm camera into a 42mm camera, just like zooming... Exactly as it would happen to an APS-C camera...
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