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Old May 20, 2010, 3:25 AM   #1
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Default D-SLR without mirrors

Maybe the answer to this is already covered in another thread, then, please just point me to it.
With digital cameras not requiring the mirrors found in a traditional SLR camera, I'm sure they can reduce the size of the body of D-SLR cameras, but I suppose with it will go smaller lenses. Are there any "smaller" D SLR cameras on the market yet?
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Old May 20, 2010, 4:04 AM   #2
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Yes, they are call EVIL camera, Electronic Viewfinder Interchangeable Lens. Currently there are 3 companies making them. Panasonic and Olympus with micro 4/3 format sensor and Samsung with the APS-C sensor. Soon Sony with another APS-C sensor.

The M4/3 is the most establish, and have the largest lens options. Also with adapaters, you can over 600 different legacy lenses on them with manual focus and aperture. And will accept all the 4/3 lenses with adapter, push with micro 4/3. You can use panasonic lenses on olympus bodies and visa-versa with full Auto Focus, metering and aperture control.

The olympus models are very small in size, the EP-1, EP-2 and EPL-1. The EP2 and EPL-1 you can use a removable electronic viewfinder besides the lcd. EP2 come with the EVF standare, epl-1 is a option. Olympus has the best jpeg engine in the industry currently. So if you are not into RAW shooting and Editing. You get great results out the camera.

Panasonic has small dslr looking cameras in the G1, GH1, G2 and G10 with built in electronic viewfinders very similar setup like a dslr with control layouts, and a compact in the GF1 that you can add a optional removable viewfinder. They have some of the best lenses on the market, with leica glass.

Samsung has the NX-10 it look like a dslr, and has a built in view finder. It is set up in a way a dslr user would feel comfortable using.

Sony will be coming out with their Nex 3 and 5, currently you only can use the lcd to compose. A EVF is in the works, but will not be out before the Nex's hit the market. Sony will be coming out with a adapter to allow their new E mount Nex to use their current Alpha and minolta lenses form their dslrs's

I have the epl-1, which was award TIPA's top compact system camera.

http://forums.steves-digicams.com/ol...mpression.html

http://www.steves-digicams.com/camer...l1-review.html

http://www.steves-digicams.com/camer...h1-review.html

PS

mircro 4/3 and 4/3 have the same sensor size. So they are smaller the the APS-c. So low light is good to about 800iso with the panasonic, and with the olympus ep1 and eps about 1000iso. The EPL-1 has a reworked sensor, so it is good to 2000iso, and workable upto 3200 iso.

The APS-c that sony and samsung will let you shoot up at 3200iso,
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Last edited by shoturtle; May 20, 2010 at 10:31 AM.
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Old May 20, 2010, 9:17 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shoturtle View Post
The APS-c that sony and samsung will let you shoot up at 3200iso,
The new Sony NEX-3 and NEX-5 models can go up to ISO 12,800.

From high ISO speed image comparisons I've seen so far, they're much better than any of their EVIL competitors at higher ISO speeds (and are comparable or better than most dSLR models with APS-C size sensors at higher ISO speeds).

Note that imaging-resource.com has the images from the NEX-5 available in it's comparometer now if you want to compare high ISO speed images with other cameras.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/IMCOMP/COMPS01.HTM

You can read more about them here, and Sony has a video online showing some of their features and menus:

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...s#/nex5Section

They're taking pre-orders now (they'll start shipping next month):

http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/...=S_NEX_Cameras
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Old May 20, 2010, 9:49 AM   #4
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That is cool that imaging-resources has photo of it already. My only thing is I would like to see low light shots with 12800 iso to see the noise in the dark areas for my needs. The new sensor has allot of dynamic range. Now if they get more lenses for it out soon that would help. Hopefully they will do what samsung did and have 5 lenses for it withing 3 month of launch. That would be better. And get a model out without a touch screen gui
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Old May 20, 2010, 10:07 AM   #5
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AFAIK, the only lenses that will be available upon launch are the 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 and a 16mm f/2.8 Pancake (with an 18-200mm lens coming later). As for anything more, we'll have to wait and see.

Now, you would be able to use Minolta A mount (a.k.a., Maxxum, Dynax, Alpha mount) lenses via an adapter. But, you wouldn't have Autofocus with them.
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Old May 20, 2010, 10:10 AM   #6
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What, with the alpha lens you get no AF. What about lenses that have built in motors? Like the sigma HSM models?
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Old May 20, 2010, 10:12 AM   #7
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I have seen some forum threads reporting that Sony's SAM and SSM type lenses (those have a built in motor) would Autofocus via the Adapter with some of the pre-release firmware. But, apparently, the latest Production (1.0 release) firmware will not allow AF with them via the Adapter. So, my guess is that they found some issues with it. But, I wouldn't be surprised if they enabled that feature later via a firmware update if they can work out the "quirks"
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Old May 20, 2010, 10:23 AM   #8
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hmm, very strange,

That would cause it to lose it's appeal for alpha owners a bit, the lens not AF with the full dslr lenses.
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Old May 20, 2010, 10:43 AM   #9
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Reports are conflicting so far. I've seen threads on sites with photographers using the NEX cameras with pre-release firmware saying they did focus with SSM lenses. Yet, I'm seeing reports from reviewers on some sites saying that the 1.0 firmware does not allow AF via an adapter.

But, Sony said they would allow AF via an adapter in interviews about it. Here's one example:

Quote:
...Autofocus should be working with the adapter and we have engineers still working very hard...
http://www.ephotozine.com/article/In...atsumoto-13659

So, my guess is that they'll figure out a way to get it working via an update, even if the initial 1.0 release firmware doesn't allow it for some reason.
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Old May 20, 2010, 11:10 AM   #10
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Quote:
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That is cool that imaging-resources has photo of it already. My only thing is I would like to see low light shots with 12800 iso to see the noise in the dark areas for my needs.
IR tests cameras in a variety of lighting levels (and more than one lighting type), at various ISO speeds. You'll find some low light tests here:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/NEX5/NEX5A7.HTM

Also, if you use the comparometer feature and look at the images of a Mannequin marked "New Indoor (INB) 12800", as compared to other cameras, you'll see tests in incandescent lighting (versus simulated daylight lighting), since sensor response curves can vary by lighting temperature. Look at areas like under the chin and more for differences in darker areas.

From what I can tell, noise levels are significantly lower compared to your T1i in that type of lighting (and you'll be more likely to use higher ISO speeds in lighting that has temperatures closer to Incandescent versus Daylight lighting). Sony's NR is a bit more aggressive (but, I doubt the T1i is going to be able to match it for detail, given similar noise levels after Post Processing for noise in that type of lighting, as the noise is quite a bit higher with the T1i images from what I can tell).

See the thumbnails page for more samples in a variety of lighting conditions (as well as more than one NR setting). You'll find a similar thumbnails page for other cameras they've reviewed.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/NEX5/NEX5THMB.HTM
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