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Old Aug 24, 2005, 10:51 PM   #1
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I HAVE READ SOME POSTS AND IT SEEMS EVERYONE SUFFERS WITH THE SAME DELEMA. WE ALL WANT THE PERFECT CAMERA FOR ANY AND ALL SHOOTING SITUATIONS, AT OUR FINGERTIPS, WITH THE RIGHT LENS AND FEATURES SET AND READY TO GO AT THE BLINK OF AN EYE. ME TOO! I WAS HOPING THAT BY NOW WE'D HAVE A PROCESSOR HOOKED TO OUR BRAIN, SO THAT ALL YOU'D HAVE TO DO IS BLINK AND THE PICTURE WOULD BE CAPTURED JUST THE WAY YOU SAW IT; BUT ALAS IT JUST AIN'T SO. SO, I'M AWUNDERING, MYSELF IF SOME OR ONE OF YOU HIGHLY KNOWLEDGEABLE GUYS, (OR GALS) MIGHT STEER ME TOOWARDS MY POT OF GOLD AT THE END OF MY RAINBOW. HERE GOES: I STARTED OUT THINKING A KODAK Z740 W/10X ZOOM LOOKED NICE, BUT NO I.S. THEN I THOUGHT KM DIAMAGE Zsomething MIGHT BE BETTER. I CAME ACROSS THE NIKON 8800 AND THAT LOOKED LIKE THE RIGHT CHOICE, BUT WHY NOT D-SLR FOR NOT TOO MUCH MORE MONEY. I TALKED AND LISTENED AND READ AND LIKED THE CANNON 20D. I EVEN TOUCHED IT AND IT FELT GOOOOD. IS IT TOO MUCH CAMERA FOR MY NEEDS? YES, BUT NOT FOR MY WANTS. I LOOKED AT THE REBEL XT (350D) AND I JOIN THE MANY WHO JUST DON'T LIKE THE FEEL IN MY HAND. I HAVE A FRIEND WITH THE NIKON D70 AND HE LOVES IT, BUT HE HAD A TON OF NIKON LENS'S SO THAT WAS A KEY FACTOR. I WOULD GO WITH THE D70s IF I WENT NIKON, BUT THEN I'VE READ IN ONE OF YOUR POSTS THAT THE D50 HAS SOME ADVANTAGES OVER THE D70s. I'M NOT A PENTAX FAN NOR DO I THINK I WANT A KM 7D OR 5D, EVEN THOUGH I CURRENTLY OWN A MINOLTA 35mm FILM SLR, I GUESS I WOULD NOT RULE EITHER OUT IF I THOUGHT THEY WERE TRUELY THE BEST FOR ME. I GUESS I AM STILL GRAPPLING WITH WHEATHER TO GO WITH A FIXED LENS PROSUMER TYPE DIGICAM OR MOVE UP TO THE D-SLR? DID I SAY I REALLY LIKED THE CANNON D20. YEA, WELL! I JUST WANT GREAT PICTURES EVERYTIME I PRESS THE SHUTTER RELEASE AND NO EXCUSES. MOST OF MY PICTURE TAKING IS OF NATURE, AND THE GRANDKIDS. I LIKE ZOOM, GOTTA HAVE SOME, BUT I KNOW HOW TO MOVE IN TO GET THE SHOT WHEN I CAN. WELL, I HOPE SOMEONE HAS STUCK AROUND THIS LONG TO GIVE ME SOME ADVICE.WHAT ABOUT THE NIKON 8800 vs ?. IS THE 20D WORTH THE DIFF$? THANK YOU IN ADVANCE....
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Old Aug 24, 2005, 11:07 PM   #2
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Guy,

You said a lot, but you didn't tell us the most important part...how much digital photography experience do you have? If the answer is none, I would recommend you start with a prosumer camera and take some time to get used to it before you take the plunge into a DSLR. The perfect camera hasn't been invented yet, but each generation gets a little better. If you can wait another month or so, the soon to be released Fuji S9000 looks pretty good. With a 10.7X zoom, 9 MP resolution. and ISO 1600 sensitivity, this camera looks like all you could want in a digicam, at about half the price of a DSLR, and without the size, weight and post processing hassles.

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Old Aug 24, 2005, 11:24 PM   #3
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YEA, YOU GUESSED IT, I HAVE HAD LITTLE OR NO REAL DIGITAL EXPERIENCE. I DIDN'T THINK IT WAS THAT MUCH DIFFERENT THEN FILM, EXCEPT FOR THE MEDIA. IT APPEARS I AM WRONG. I CAN WAIT SOME FOR THE FUJI S9000, BUT WHERE DOED THE NIKON 8800 FIT INTO THE MIX?
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Old Aug 26, 2005, 7:47 PM   #4
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The Fuji S9000 looks really nice and I would to hold it and see how it feels. What are the post processing hassles with a D-SLR over prosumer? Are D-SLR's a lot different then shooting a film SLR? I have this underlying fear of mass battery consumption with the nicer prosumer digi's, and the big zooms I like.



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Old Aug 26, 2005, 9:28 PM   #5
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When you take a picture with a prosumer cam, the camera does a lot of processing for you...when you upload the pic into your computer, it's sharpened, colors are saturated, everything is pleasing to the eye. The compression used however tends to destroy some of the original image. The DSLR does little or no in-camera processing, so the pics may not look real great when you first upload them into your computer, but almost all of the original image information is available. After some post processing, the DSLR pics will be quite superior to the prosumer pics.

Battery consumption is not that bad with the megazooms, which usually get around 350 or more shots per charge (assuming NiMH or Li-Ion batteries).

The 8800 (IMHO) is a poor excuse for a DSLR replacement, since it only has ISO 400 sensitivity, and shows considerable noise at that speed. The S9000, although not yet released, will have ISO 1600 capability, and will have an MSRP of about $300 less than the 8800 had when first released. Although the S9000 will exhibit a lot more noise at the higher ISO settings than a DSLR, due to a smaller sensor size, the higher ISO capability will permit a lot of low light opportunities that would not be possible with the 8800. And with a start-up time of 0.8 seconds, and a shutter lag of 0.01 seconds (pre-focused), the S9000 will make the 8800 look like a slug...no offense to 8800 owners.

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Old Aug 27, 2005, 12:54 PM   #6
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Thank you for the explanation, I can see the differences, but is that the case straight across the board? I mean when shooting in J-peg or RAW the D-SLR still needs post processing? I have and use Adobe Photoshop CS to retouch my photos now from film. I use to scan them from the negatives, but now I just get them on CD, but the pictures do look pretty good to strat with. I only adjust what I think will improve the picture or make it look the way I want it too.Would it be necessary to adjust every picture in order to have a printable image from the D-SLR? I don' think I would like that.

The Fuji S-9000 is an awesome looking camera, and if it performsas well as it looks,it will likely be my choice. Have you heard a more precise date for the release?

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Old Aug 28, 2005, 12:13 PM   #7
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What about the noise issues I've read about when shooting higher ISO's on a prosumer type digicam? In several posts I've read that shooting at or above ISO 400 is a waste. Do you think the Fuji S9000 sill fall into that catagory? It's great to have higher speeds, if you can use them.

:idea:I went to the local Ritz yesterday, for what that's worth, and asked about a good high end camera. I made reference to prosumer catagory, ie; Panasonic Fz20 or Fuji S5200, something 5 to 8 megs and some zoom. The salesman said they won't be carrying Fuji any longer :sad:, he didn't say why, and went right to recommending the Cannon 350XT. Perhaps it's it just the fact that he's a salesman and the commisions are bigger on the D-SLR's, but he's not aware of any post processing headaches with D-SLR's unless you are shooting RAW.

:? I'm not sure of the advantages of spending $700.00 on a non-dslr to learn the ropes of digital photography, only to then spend another $1000.00 or more to buy theD-SLR latter. Don't get me wrong, I like the look and ease of the Fuji S9000. It looks like it is as close to an D-SLR as you can get without being one, but if that's the case why not cross the line. The size and weight of the S9000 are not small in stature, so that's not a factor.

I'll go back to my earlier statement about not wanting to be required to post-process every picture inorder to be able to get a decent 4x6 or 5x7 print, but I'm not sure if that is the case just because it's a D-SLR. Can anyone tell me if when you take a picture with a D-SLR, you must make adjustments to get a quality print.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 12:04 PM   #8
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?GUY wrote:
Quote:
What about the noise issues I've read about when shooting higher ISO's on a prosumer type digicam? In several posts I've read that shooting at or above ISO 400 is a waste. Do you think the Fuji S9000 sill fall into that catagory? It's great to have higher speeds, if you can use them.

:idea:I went to the local Ritz yesterday, for what that's worth, and asked about a good high end camera. I made reference to prosumer catagory, ie; Panasonic Fz20 or Fuji S5200, something 5 to 8 megs and some zoom. The salesman said they won't be carrying Fuji any longer :sad:, he didn't say why, and went right to recommending the Cannon 350XT. Perhaps it's it just the fact that he's a salesman and the commisions are bigger on the D-SLR's, but he's not aware of any post processing headaches with D-SLR's unless you are shooting RAW.

:? I'm not sure of the advantages of spending $700.00 on a non-dslr to learn the ropes of digital photography, only to then spend another $1000.00 or more to buy theD-SLR latter. Don't get me wrong, I like the look and ease of the Fuji S9000. It looks like it is as close to an D-SLR as you can get without being one, but if that's the case why not cross the line. The size and weight of the S9000 are not small in stature, so that's not a factor.

I'll go back to my earlier statement about not wanting to be required to post-process every picture inorder to be able to get a decent 4x6 or 5x7 print, but I'm not sure if that is the case just because it's a D-SLR. Can anyone tell me if when you take a picture with a D-SLR, you must make adjustments to get a quality print.
The Fuji S5200 apparently uses the same "Real Photo Technology" which is in the F10, and it allows remarkably noise-free high ISO images. A DSLR would still be better, but among non-DSLR cameras, the S5200 will probably be head and shoulders above the competition in terms of noise-free images, if the F10 is any indication. But we'll have to wait until we see some sample images to be sure.

If you're worried about being able to get good prints out of a DSLR without having to do any post-processing, I would suggest that you print a few of the sample images from the Canon 20D, the Nikon D70s, and other DSLR's, that are included in the reviews in this site. Then print some sample images from some prosumer cameras and compare them to the DSLR images. See how happy you are with the picturesstraight out of the camera.
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Old Aug 29, 2005, 12:15 PM   #9
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That's a great idea, one I would not have thought of. I'll give it a try and get back to you.

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Old Aug 29, 2005, 8:39 PM   #10
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Well I've printed a couple of images from the samples in the reviews and I can see good and bad in either group, dslr or prosumer. The prosumer is generally sharper and has a bit more color saturation then the dslr in raw, but the differences are less when shooting in large/fine resolution. From what I can see I will likely be adjusting the images I get wheather I'm using prosumer or dslr. It's kinda what I like to do.I like the feel of the dslr's in my hand and the fact that you can expand your capabilities with different lens. I also like the ease and convience of the prosumer type and will wait a little longer to see the Fuji S9000 when it hits the market, if that's not too long from now.

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