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Old Sep 7, 2005, 7:39 AM   #11
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Long term, take a look at the lens system you want to invest in.

Minolta doesn't put out many cameras or lenses for that matter.

If you invest in a Canon, you'll have lots of choices to upgrade to in the future, and hopefully you'll be able to bring your lenses with you.

The minolta is a very narrow path to the future.


I'd argue the opposite. You've also got third party lenses from Tamron, Vivitar, Tokina, Sigma and others in Minolta AF mount available, and they'd all benefit from antishake.

Then, look at what Sony and Konica-Minolta will be doing (sharing technology, with Sony releasing DSLR models that can use this lens mount). That increases incentative for third parth lens manufacturers to better support this mount, too.

Sony makes the sensors for most Nikon DSLR models, Pentax DSLR models, and Konica-Minolta DSLR models.

Sony has also made the sensors formany of Canon's non-DSLR products (as they do for many others). Canon doesn't make their own sensors for non-DSLR cameras.

When you see multiple manufacturers releasing a product with similar specs at the same time, it's usually based on the same sensor. Take the 7MP models using a 1/1.8" sensor (including Canon's). It's a Sony sensor.

If you missed the press releases, Sony has announced that they will begin shipping DSLR models next year that use Konica-Minolta AF lenses. In addition KM plans onproducing 50,000 cameras per month with the 5D (a dramatic increase over the 7D). Here's the news on this site about Sony using this lens mount:

http://www.steves-digicams.com/digin....html#sony_slr

I don't think we'll need to worry about there not being a future in this lens mount with Sony teaming up with Konica-Minolta and releasing DSLR models that will use it.

In fact, one of the reasons I plan on buying a KM DSLR soon is because the lenses are in good supply on the used market (since KM was "late to the party" entering the DSLR market, the "feeding frenzy" seen for other DSLR models hasn't eaten up the lens supply -- yet).

I wanted to get them at bargain prices, before the supply dries up (with the prices rising from demand).

So far, I've bought the Minolta 28mm f/2, 50mm f/1.7, 100mm f/2, 135mm f/2.8, Tamron 20-40mm f/2.7-3.5, and 35-105mm f/2.8 in Minolta AF mount.They'll all be stabilized thanks to Antishake.

What would make a better low light system than Antishake with a fast prime with a camera able to shoot at ISO 3200 with noise comparable to Canon's current models based on tests I've seen (and I could get faster primes that I purchased in some focal lengths like 50mm and 85mm)?

Also, manufacturers have a tendency to "leapfrog" each other (as history has shown). We should be seeing some pretty interesting stuff in the not so distant future (the way technology keeps advancing, I'd count on it).

I'm sure Sony hasn't been "standing still" with their sensor R&D.

KM isn't without it's problems. For example, they are going to liquidate KM Photo Imaging, Inc. in Canada and go with a 3rd party distribution and service system there (as they do in some other countries). But, I feel comfortable with buying a product using Minolta lenses (especially due to Sony's announcement on releasing DSLR models next year using this lens mount).

Of course, most important to me, is that Konica-Minolta has the "only game in town" if you want a wider variety of lenses (including fast primes) that let you hand hold a camera at shutter speeds 2 to 3 stops slower than you could without a tripod or monopod.

For something like Motorsports, that could work pretty nice. You could even slow down shutter speeds deliberately for effect (to blur your backgrounds more), taking advantage of the built in antishake (which automatically recognizes when you're panning, correcting for the vertical axis only). I saw some interesting shots where someone used antishake this way a while back (deliberately using slower shutter speeds than needed for effect, without the bulk of a tripod).


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Old Sep 7, 2005, 9:46 AM   #12
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I think the 1gb CF card is the best deal at the moment.

Yer paying too much for the 2gb cards.

Buy a 1gb card now, and then buy a bigger one when they get cheap in a year or two.

-- Terry
Well said.
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Old Sep 7, 2005, 10:40 AM   #13
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Jim C,

A very enlightening response!

I think you have an interesting angle there, buying up used lenses before the market responds and eats them up!

Definitely Minolta has responded interestingly with the anti-shake built into the body.

The only problem with the 5D in my mind, anti-shake or not, is that the resultant image produced by the 5D is inferior to the Canon sensor. From that perspective, I'd rather get the better sensor, and buy an anti-shake lens if I felt I really needed it.

I was unaware that Sony and Minolta were teaming up to take on Canon. Good thing they are, because Canon is dominating the SLR market right now. Maybe more competition will result in better technology and lower prices for consumers.

My guess is the Canon 5D is the shape of things to come.

The biggest constraint for D-SLR's is the cropping factor, leaving D-SLR owners scraping to find lenses with the wide angle capacity of their 35mm film body breathren.

The Canon5D solves the problem by offeringa full frame sensor.I see the future (in the next few years)of 12 and 16 meg full frame sensorD-SLRs falling into the $1000-2000 range.

I see Canon leading the way.

So, if you want to buy up old lenses, buy up old Canon lenses because soon you will be able to afford a full frame digital D-SLR with no compromise to your old film lenses!

I wonder how many years it will take for Minolta to respond to that challenge, and whether Sony and Minolta will still be in the D-SLR game?

Your comments appreciated!

Terry








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Old Sep 7, 2005, 11:07 AM   #14
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The only problem with the 5D in my mind, anti-shake or not, is that the resultant image produced by the 5D is inferior to the Canon sensor. From that perspective, I'd rather get the better sensor, and buy an anti-shake lens if I felt I really needed it.

That's a matter of opinion. I've seen pros that own both Canon and KM models say that they prefer the Konica-Minolta color accuracy. ;-)

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My guess is the Canon 5D is the shape of things to come.

The biggest constraint for D-SLR's is the cropping factor, leaving D-SLR owners scraping to find lenses with the wide angle capacity of their 35mm film body breathren.
If you haven't noticed, lenses designed specifically for sensors with a crop factor can get around some of the design problems, offering a compact wide angle solution since the image circle doesn't need to be as large.

For example, KM announced some new lenses that are going to be shipping this month, developed with Tamron.Look for the Konica Minolta AF DT11-18mm F4.5-5.6 (D), AF DT18-70mm F3.5-5.6(D), and AF DT18-200mm F3.5-6.3 (D) lenses on store shelves soon (if not shipping already in some locations). The 18-70 is the kit lens for the 5D.

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So, if you want to buy up old lenses, buy up old Canon lenses because soon you will be able to afford a full frame digital D-SLR with no compromise to your old film lenses!

I wonder how many years it will take for Minolta to respond to that challenge, and whether Sony and Minolta will still be in the D-SLR game?
Errr, hmmm... You may want to change that to "I wonder how many months...."

There are some pretty interesting discussioins going on around the net about what the Konica-Minolta Maxxum 9D will be about, since KM has confirmed they are working on another model(and one ofthe sources posting has been known to be reliable in the past). I personally think we'll see some announcements around February (speculation based on rumour,butI wouldn't be surprised to see something even before then).

That's one of the reasons I'm leaning towards sticking with lenses that will work full frame (I personally don't think Canon is going to be the only game in town for full frame sensors in the future). But, if I'm wrong, no big deal. There are plenty of lens choices around, and a cropped sensor using lenses designed for 35mm allows you to use the lens "sweet spot" anyway, avoiding some of the edge softness you could get with the same lens on a 35mm camera (or full frame DSLR).




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Old Sep 7, 2005, 11:13 AM   #15
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The image is inferior in what way?
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Old Sep 7, 2005, 11:32 AM   #16
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Are you in a big hurry?

If not, wait until Steve's review is done and compare the sample images from both cameras with your own eyes.

Also, in addition to antishake, the new KM 5D has ISO 3200 (something the Canon Rebel XT doesn't offer). You'd need to deliberately underexpose by astop to try and simulate it with the Canon, and if you're not shooting in raw, you tend to get more artificactsboosting brightnessback up later using software when using this technique.


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Old Sep 7, 2005, 11:39 AM   #17
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I am definitely waiting for reviews....from some of the Taiwanese site's review on Dynax 5D though I think the camera is plenty competitive, they said the image looks softer with warmer hue than the D50/D70, and the color looks similar to the XT, and from the image(though not full size), I'd agree...



Hopefully though I can get it before end of Sept, as I do have an oppotunity to try it at that time, but realistically I am not in a big hurry.
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Old Sep 7, 2005, 11:46 AM   #18
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All of these cameras are somewhat adjustable for how the images are processed (color, sharpness, saturation, contrast, etc.) when shooting JPEG.

In raw, the tool you use has more to do with that kind of thing (since you're bypassing the camera's image processing and using software later to process the sensor data).

Also, lenses can impact color. For example, most Tamron lenses tend to lean towards slightly warmer color (which I personally like). Of course, software allows you do adjust that kind of thing to suit your tastes in Post Processing.

Lenses also impact contrast, sharpness, and even the quality of out of focus areas. Some lenses have pretty bad "bokeh". Reviewers rarely use equal quality lenses when comparing cameras.

P.S.

BTW, I've spent some time running some of the images from this model through a new version of dcraw.c over the past few days. I've been quite impressed with the detail this camera is capable of capturing in raw. Dave Coffin (the author of dcraw.c) released a new version September 1 using some very interestingcolor interpolation algorithms for Bayer pattern sensors compared to previous versions of dcraw.c.

He's supported the 5D since August 5 (he added it after I sent him some .mrw files from a model areviewer borrowed from KM in Thailand). It works quite well, and color accuracy is great (we also sent him a Macbeth Color chart to make surehis codewas optimized for it).

I'm interested in this camera myself, so I want the best tools available for getting the most out of this sensor. ;-)

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