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Old Sep 8, 2005, 7:29 PM   #1
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I have searched a lot for a review or comparison pages but can't find any, so what would you guys recomend for an entry level SLR, the maxxum 5d or the Rebel 350?

A lot of people are using the 350D and I know i can't go wrong with that, it was my original choice, and was about to buy it, but then i found out about the 5D and specially the Anti-Shakre really catched my eye.

My camera needs are pretty wide:

Regular all-around photos
Nature shooting ( plaing on getting Sigma 70-300 for this)
would like to do close ups

and mainly i will like to use my camera to create virtual tours with a fully immersive images ( 360°x180°) with a peleng fisheye lens.

I've read how the kit lens on the Rebel is cr*p, and on the Maxxum is an ok lens, but also read about the rebel having more buffer, don't even know if I need more buffer.

so considering all of this, is the Rebel BETTER than the maxxum ? or do i really need to make a personal choice?

Thanks in advance

Shanti Castillo G.
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Old Sep 8, 2005, 8:44 PM   #2
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Everyone is going to have their own opnion. But, I would personally lean towards the Konica-Minolta model.

Here is a similar thread discussing pros and cons of entry level DSLR models, including the Rebel XT and KM 5D:

http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...mp;forum_id=87


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Old Sep 8, 2005, 9:57 PM   #3
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Thanks i am starting to lean over the 5d, i just wish there was a review somewhere :S


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Old Sep 8, 2005, 10:11 PM   #4
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I've read my share of them (mostly from overseas users).

So far, I've been pretty impressed with the camera's photos and capabilities (and the used lens market here is pretty good for getting bargain prices on Minolta AF lenses).

If you're not in a big hurry, wait on Steve's review. He's got a 5D now (but there are lots of cameras "in the queue", so I'm not sure how soon he'll get his review done).


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Old Sep 9, 2005, 1:32 AM   #5
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I have seriously looked into this as well. Each camera has its strenth and weakness.

Minolta: AS is great, but images are really fuzzy. A lot of easily accessible manual controls (great for pros), few auto options (harder for beginners) Heavy - you know I suspect minolta intentionally made it heavy so the shake is less which makes the AS seem more effective but that's just one of my many conspiracy theories.

Canon: great high ISO, sharper image. everyone use it. reliable quality (compared to all the dead Nikon D70)

The bottom line: 95% people use a non AS camera and many of them are pros. If you just want to learn photography you really don't want to get yourself spoiled with AS. If you are a pro and you find AS helpful in your style of shooting, then go for it.

And don't rule out Olympus E300 (great auto and ergonomics) and Nikon (really nice sharpness image quality).

And finally, yeah you can ditch Pentax they are impossible to adjust the settings. Just read Ken Rockwell's reviews.


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Old Sep 9, 2005, 5:25 AM   #6
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Leon you made some good points there.

I am a begginer/amateur but never even used a AS systemin my life,I kinda thought this was going to work the other way, AS helping me learn:roll:

also you said Minolta has fuzzy images? all I've seen arevery crisp.

sinceI am going from time to time share this camera with my mom, she need some auto settingsI thought the 5d had less buttons and more shooting scenes, than the 7d, is the 350 better for a begginer/amateur?

Iamthinkingof usinga 300mm zoom lens, would the AS help me more handheld?
or would the 350d be alright without the use of a tripod?

I don't want a camera just becuase "everyone uses it" but its true a lot of people have a rebel.

Thanks for the reply

Shanti Castillo G.

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Old Sep 9, 2005, 8:33 AM   #7
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Shanti wrote:
Quote:
Leon you made some good points there.
I saw one good point:

leon3536 wrote:
Quote:
I have seriously looked into this as well. Each camera has its strenth and weakness.
That's true, any camera has it's strengths and weaknesses.

Quote:
Minolta: AS is great, but images are really fuzzy. A lot of easily accessible manual controls (great for pros), few auto options (harder for beginners) Heavy - you know I suspect minolta intentionally made it heavy so the shake is less which makes the AS seem more effective but that's just one of my many conspiracy theories.
Hmmmm... Images are really fuzzy, huh? I can take fuzzy photos with any camera. Unless you take similar photos in the same conditions, using the same settings, with similar lenses, you can't judge a camera. Even then, you have to consider the amount of adjustment a camera has for things like color, sharpness, saturation and contrast. Users I've seen buy this camera have been impressed with it's image quality.

Entry level cameras tend to lean towards having more "punch" directly from the camera (boosting brightness, contrast, sharpness and saturation). This can result in loss of highlight and shadow detail, as well as leaving halos around edges (since in camera sharpening is an optical illusion, created by increasing the contrast in pixels at edge transitions).

If you like that, turn up the settings.

If you don't, leave them set lower (so you have much more control over it in Post Processing, as not to ruin your images that you may want to blow up to larger sizes later).

Any camera can take bad photos. Put a cheap lens on an expensive camera, coupled with a user that's trying to use it outside of it's capabilities, and what do you get? Soft images.

"Few auto options". Huh? Where in the world did you get that from? Have you even looked at the features available on this camera.

If you really wantsome basic "Scene Modes" (which I wouldn't use), the Konica-Minolta 5D has some (portrait, sports, landscape, evening sunset view, and night view).

This camera is "heavy"? You've got to be kidding. Just because the Rebel XT is lighter, doesn't mean that the other is heavy. Also, a lighter camera isn't as well balanced (especially with heavier lenses, or a hotshoe attached flash (which can make the camera "top heavy".

Quote:
The bottom line: 95% people use a non AS camera and many of them are pros.
Maybe that's because no other DSLR manufacturer has Antishake built into the body. Many pros buy Canon's stabilized (IS) lenses. Only, you can't get many types of lenses with IS (bright primes, etc.). With Antishake in the body, all of your lenses benefit (without the extra cost tacked on for stabilization built into each lens you buy with this feature).

Quote:
If you just want to learn photography you really don't want to get yourself spoiled with AS. If you are a pro and you find AS helpful in your style of shooting, then go for it.
That's a great idea. Let's not buy AS becausewe might be"spoiled". :-)

Perhaps we shouldn't buy cameras with Autofocus either. Or, perhaps we shouldn't buy cameras with Autoexposure, or perhaps we should rule out built in metering (and the list goes on).

That's the weakest argument I've heard against AS (because you don't want to get yourself spoiled with AS). Turn it off if you really don't want to be spoiled by it.

Quote:
And don't rule out Olympus E300 (great auto and ergonomics) and Nikon (really nice sharpness image quality).

And finally, yeah you can ditch Pentax they are impossible to adjust the settings. Just read Ken Rockwell's reviews.
Ken Rockwell, huh?He admits that he's never even touched these cameras (Pentax *ist DS, Olympus E-300)

AsLeon said, any camera has it's strengths and weaknesses.

Go down to a store and try them out for yourself. See how they feel (to you, since each user may have different preferences in ergonomics, control layout, menu systems, viewfinder, etc.

If you want to see how images from the cameras you are considering compare whentaking photos of similar subjects, wait for Steve's review.
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Old Sep 9, 2005, 8:48 AM   #8
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Shanti-

Let's take this one point at a time, please. A 300mm lens will yield more useable photos on the KM 5D than the Canon 350D/XT due to the AS. The grip on the KM 5D is better than the Canon XT, which also gives another point to the KM 5D.

That being said, let's move to buttons and functions. IMHO neither the KM 5D nor the Canon XT are really cameras for real beginners, if you expect to pull really great photos from these digital cameras automatically, it may be harder than you think. The KM 5D and the Canon XT are more digital cameras for dedicated ametuers with some experience, and advanced photographers.The the external buttons on both the 5D and, its big brother the 7D are to save you the task of going into the menu, those buttons not necessarily designed to help beginners. Scene modes are available on these two cameras but they are very small in content, when compared to a consumer digital camera such as the Canon SD-500, which has many automatic features and scene modes.It is only my opinion, but the Canon XT and the KM 5D make the assumption that you already have some experience and know how to use such things as ISO settings, exposure compensation, and can deal with strong backlighting.

You may indeed save yourself a lot of money and frustration, if you reconsider a bit. There is a lot more expense to a dSLR than just the camera body and the kit lens. You are getting into multiple lenses and some rather sophisticated flash gear as well if you want to shoot flash photos beyond 10 feet.

Believe me, I am not attempting to dampen your enthusiasm at all, rather I desire that you really know what you are getting into up front. Naturally you are probably asking yourself how can I be saying these things. Well I am a digital camera instructor and I own and use the Canon 20D, the Canon 350D/XT, the Nikon D-70, and the Pentax 1st SD. So I come from many years of experience. I am sincerely just attempting to save you some disappointment and frustration.

Sarah Joyce
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Old Sep 9, 2005, 2:50 PM   #9
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Sarah, thanks for the reply, I am not a TOTAL begginer,I admit i've never used a dSLR before,I have used film slrs even thougI never owned one, and i've had prosumers (used a LOT in M mode) and p&s ( ok those probably don't count :roll since the Sony mavica was king:? but how can I REALLY learn if i just stick to p&s or prosumers just becauseI don't want to get frustrated?:?

I am aware of the extra expenses thats whyI am considering a couple lenses withmy purchase,I have no flash shooting in mind, butI can also consider it no problem. I don't expect perfect results as soon asI open the box, but the reason I asked about the automatic functions is because my mom will be borrowing the camera from time to time, shes an artist (painter) so she looks to photograph subjects or her paintings but she is not really into photography.

Thanks JimC that sounds soo much better, and so much like the other comments i've read about KM 5d

Shanti Castillo G.
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Old Sep 9, 2005, 6:37 PM   #10
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Thanks, Shanti-

I was just attempting to forestall problems. I sounds as if the KM 5D will work nicely for you, and that you have very realistic expectations.

Sarah Joyce
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