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Old Dec 5, 2005, 6:16 PM   #11
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Why not consider the Canon REbel XT?

Nice smooth 8mp CMOS sensor, and clean images at high ISO's.

Plus, your Canon lens investment won't be wasted as you'll have lots of Canon bodies to consider in the future.

-- Terry
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 6:30 PM   #12
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Terry

The Rebel XT is typically a couple of hundred dollars more expensive from the Canadian sources I have checked, and that is with just the kit lens. I already have Pentax lenses, and the Olympus kit has 2 lenses for less money than the Rebel XT body only. The Nikon D50 is more in my price range, costing a little less than the Pentax, but again that is just with one lens.

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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:07 PM   #13
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I actually have both the XT and DS (XT, I use @ Work) just because this seems to be moving that direction I will metion a couple things I have noticed vs the DS.¬*¬*- The viewfinder is very small in comparison to the DS- The ergonomics of the camera are very difficult to get used.¬* One example would be the rear status LCD above preview LCD is pointless.- The 8MP is nice but I wouldn't give up high ISO performance of the D50 and DS for it
-The write speed on it is nice-I find the kit lens to be ok, however, the 18-55 on DS is far superior to it.In the end its a nice very capable camera.¬* However, I can't help but feel it is built to force you up the Canon ladder.¬* In regards to buying into a system, Canon and Nikon are nice but they are not the only players on the block with "systems".¬* Pentax alone has a fairly impressive lens collection and Olyimpus and KM have some very nice glass available.¬* Unless, your going to need a DX2 or a¬* EOS-5D I wouldn't think too hard about the bodies.¬* Since all the players have mid-level and prosumer camera¬* on the road map.¬*N and C aren't always the best becuase everyone uses them.... people should go with what fits them best.¬*
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:12 PM   #14
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Okay, Monza, I'm a former Canadian living in the US so I'm going to level with you.

The Pentax probably has the worst of the image quality of all the DSLR's, so I'd skip that camera all together.

The Olympus is a cool camera, but the lenses are freakishly expensive.

Probably a most useful lens are the wide angles, and the 4/3's system hasa cropping factor that kills you on the wide angle.

Personally, I wouldn't worry about a few hundred dollars now, as your investing in a system that should tide you over for the next 5-10 years at least.

If you own lenses that are slower than F2.8, then you should be thinking about upgrading your lenses. Don't choose a camera cause you got some old slow lenses you want to reuse.

Okay, you think you don't need 8 megapixels but think about cropping.

Most decent photographers shoot wide, then crop later. So, expect to lose 20 to 50 percent of your frame with after the fact cropping.

I'd rather be starting out with an 8 mp image than a 6mp from that perspective.

Also, given you sound like your becoming a serious photographer, you should consider shooting RAW images then processing them to JPEGS or whatever.

If your shooting Canon RAW images, they are 8mb images, capable of producing 5mb JPEGS. Assume you'll need a large hard drive.

So here's a recommendation:

- Stick with Nikon or Canon, that's what the pro's and serious photogs use.

- Consider your lenses slower than F2.8 as cheap amateur stuff and sell them while you still can. Don't upgrade on a basis of some old crap.

- Get a cam that can do serious high ISO stuff, only the Canon Rebel XTor the Nikon D50 will deliver.

- Spend some time on PBASE and look up some image examples from the Canon or the Nikon D50. See which one has the better image quality (guess what, the Canon wins!)

Hey, buy what you want, but you seem like your getting interested in photography, so why buy offbeat stuff?

As for a few extra hundred dollars, there's nothing wrong with eating RAMEN noodles for a couple of months if you end up with a decent camera.

By the way, that Fuji S7000 was a great camera in its day.

I just sold off an old Fuji Finepix S602, and I saw the person using it the other day whom I sold it to, and I got some SERIOUS PANGS OF REMORSE. Don't sell your S7000, even if you never plan to use it again. lol.

== Terry
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:15 PM   #15
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Pentax has the worst??? lol, your going to level with him... my god...¬* calm down mr. expert.¬* It has soft .jpegs in tests that is about it and that is a setting issue.... I am not even going to get into the rest.¬* It has the same sensor as the D50 and D70 as well...¬*Buddy Relax cameras other than N and C are can deliver... lol
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:32 PM   #16
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Hey your right, the pentax and the d50 are both sony sensors.

But to be honest, when I go out on pbase, I don't like the quality of the photos off that sensor.

When I see photos off the Canon CMOS sensor, they seem to blow away the competition, especially at high ISO's.

I'm not aware of any pro's using the pentax or the the oly, at any events I've been at. Mainly Canons and high end Nikons (no D70's).

So when you say "deliver", I suspect your talking about prosumer delivery, not semi-pro or pro delivery.

This gentleman is talking about taking pictures at people's weddings (I suspect, hopefully, for money).

I personally would not show up on a paid job with a pentax or oly. Period.

-- Terry


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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:50 PM   #17
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[email protected] wrote:
[quote]

[The Pentax probably has the worst of the image quality of all the DSLR's, so I'd skip that camera all together.]

scarcely distinguishable in jpg at 100% on screen; absolutely indistinguishable considerably larger than A4; just as good in raw. Lens quality a vastly more important factor.


[If you own lenses that are slower than F2.8, then you should be thinking about upgrading your lenses.¬*¬* Don't choose a camera cause you got some old slow lenses you want to reuse.]¬*¬*¬*

Very poor advice - there are numerous excellent lenses slower than 2.8 and no one should be intimidated on that account

[Okay, you think you don't need 8 megapixels but think about cropping.¬*

Most decent photographers shoot wide, then crop later.]¬*

Some, not most.


[I'd rather be starting out with an 8 mp image than a 6mp from that perspective.]

So would I, but it's not a decisive issue imho, and anyway there'll be a higher mp Pentax dslr early next year.

[Also, given you sound like your becoming a serious photographer, you should consider shooting RAW images then processing them to JPEGS or whatever.]

Correct. And all the current DSLRs shoot excellent raw images.

[So here's a recommendation:

- Stick with Nikon or Canon, that's what the pro's and serious photogs use.]

Most pros yes, because of the easy availability of bits worldwide. But many serious photogs use other brands perfectly happily. Are you a sheep?

[Consider your lenses slower than F2.8 as cheap amateur stuff and sell them while you still can.¬* Don't upgrade on a basis of some old crap.]

Ignore him.

[Get a cam that can do serious high ISO stuff, only the Canon Rebel XT¬*or the Nikon D50 will deliver.]

Absolutely not true. Pentax DS high ISO (to 3200) is fully competitive. Haven't tried the DL - probably similar.

[Spend some time on PBASE and look up some image examples from the Canon or the Nikon D50.¬*¬*¬*¬* See which one has the better image quality (guess what, the Canon wins!)

¬*Hey, buy what you want, but you seem like your getting interested in photography, so why buy offbeat stuff?]

This guy drives a Toyota Ludicra.¬*¬*¬*
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:51 PM   #18
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[email protected] wrote:
[quote]

[The Pentax probably has the worst of the image quality of all the DSLR's, so I'd skip that camera all together.]

scarcely distinguishable in jpg at 100% on screen; absolutely indistinguishable considerably larger than A4; just as good in raw. Lens quality a vastly more important factor.


[If you own lenses that are slower than F2.8, then you should be thinking about upgrading your lenses.¬*¬* Don't choose a camera cause you got some old slow lenses you want to reuse.]¬*¬*¬*

Very poor advice - there are numerous excellent lenses slower than 2.8 and no one should be intimidated on that account

[Okay, you think you don't need 8 megapixels but think about cropping.¬*

Most decent photographers shoot wide, then crop later.]¬*

Some, not most.


[I'd rather be starting out with an 8 mp image than a 6mp from that perspective.]

So would I, but it's not a decisive issue imho, and anyway there'll be a higher mp Pentax dslr early next year.

[Also, given you sound like your becoming a serious photographer, you should consider shooting RAW images then processing them to JPEGS or whatever.]

Correct. And all the current DSLRs shoot excellent raw images.

[So here's a recommendation:

- Stick with Nikon or Canon, that's what the pro's and serious photogs use.]

Most pros yes, because of the easy availability of bits worldwide. But many serious photogs use other brands perfectly happily. Are you a sheep?

[Consider your lenses slower than F2.8 as cheap amateur stuff and sell them while you still can.¬* Don't upgrade on a basis of some old crap.]

Ignore him.

[Get a cam that can do serious high ISO stuff, only the Canon Rebel XT¬*or the Nikon D50 will deliver.]

Absolutely not true. Pentax DS high ISO (to 3200) is fully competitive. Haven't tried the DL - probably similar.

[Spend some time on PBASE and look up some image examples from the Canon or the Nikon D50.¬*¬*¬*¬* See which one has the better image quality (guess what, the Canon wins!)

¬*Hey, buy what you want, but you seem like your getting interested in photography, so why buy offbeat stuff?]

This guy drives a Toyota Ludicra.¬*¬*¬*
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 8:51 PM   #19
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[email protected] wrote:
[quote]

[The Pentax probably has the worst of the image quality of all the DSLR's, so I'd skip that camera all together.]

scarcely distinguishable in jpg at 100% on screen; absolutely indistinguishable considerably larger than A4; just as good in raw. Lens quality a vastly more important factor.


[If you own lenses that are slower than F2.8, then you should be thinking about upgrading your lenses.¬*¬* Don't choose a camera cause you got some old slow lenses you want to reuse.]¬*¬*¬*

Very poor advice - there are numerous excellent lenses slower than 2.8 and no one should be intimidated on that account

[Okay, you think you don't need 8 megapixels but think about cropping.¬*

Most decent photographers shoot wide, then crop later.]¬*

Some, not most.


[I'd rather be starting out with an 8 mp image than a 6mp from that perspective.]

So would I, but it's not a decisive issue imho, and anyway there'll be a higher mp Pentax dslr early next year.

[Also, given you sound like your becoming a serious photographer, you should consider shooting RAW images then processing them to JPEGS or whatever.]

Correct. And all the current DSLRs shoot excellent raw images.

[So here's a recommendation:

- Stick with Nikon or Canon, that's what the pro's and serious photogs use.]

Most pros yes, because of the easy availability of bits worldwide. But many serious photogs use other brands perfectly happily. Are you a sheep?

[Consider your lenses slower than F2.8 as cheap amateur stuff and sell them while you still can.¬* Don't upgrade on a basis of some old crap.]

Ignore him.

[Get a cam that can do serious high ISO stuff, only the Canon Rebel XT¬*or the Nikon D50 will deliver.]

Absolutely not true. Pentax DS high ISO (to 3200) is fully competitive. Haven't tried the DL - probably similar.

[Spend some time on PBASE and look up some image examples from the Canon or the Nikon D50.¬*¬*¬*¬* See which one has the better image quality (guess what, the Canon wins!)

¬*Hey, buy what you want, but you seem like your getting interested in photography, so why buy offbeat stuff?]

This guy drives a Toyota Ludicra.¬*¬*¬*
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Old Dec 5, 2005, 9:08 PM   #20
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Timo,

I don't think I'm a sheep at all.

I just evaluated the quality of the images I saw off different cams, and decided that the Canon CMOS was the way to go.

Canon owns 60 percent of the DSLR market.

I don't think it's about sheep, I think it's about quality.

BTW, I drive a Mistubishi Galant and it is a very crappy car! lol. I often wish I had bought aToyota, as I spend so much trying to keep the Galant on the road!

-- Terry
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