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ZAKD Dec 12, 2005 3:01 PM

Hi everyone, I have a powershot NIKON 8700 model and I'm thinking of changing it for new SLR camera.

Today I chack the prices and I have to choose something likethe listbelow. Just as a referance of price I will put the price of NIKON D70 = 1025 EUR(complete body and lens af s dx 18-70mm) and that is too much for me, but here is something possible:

1. Olympus E-1 with 14-45mm-0.38/1.3ft, 1:3.5-5.6(zuiko)=868 EUR

2. Olympus E-500 with 14-45mm 1:3.5-5.6(zuiko)=823 EUR

3. Fuji 9500 Fine pix with 28-300mm equiv.135, 1:2.8-4.958mm=652 EUR

4. Konica Minolta Dynax 5D with AF DT 18-70mm f/3.5-5.6=850EUR

5. Nikon D50 with af sx 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 G=792EUR

Does anybody has any of above mentioned, and why there is so differance of Fuji SLR camera in price, and what does it mean that some of them are with 6 Mpx and some are with 8 Mpx-is this Mpx are very important to SLR cameras for quality.

Can you put a list of above mentioned cameras as that #1 is the best one and #5 the lowest quality.

Thanks and wait5 for your suggestions

Regards Zak

RacingManiac Dec 12, 2005 4:22 PM

Reason being Fuji is not an DSLR. It is very close as it is about the highest level of prosumer, full feature Digital camera. With a non-removable manual lens with manual zoom and focus control. It still uses the small-sized sensor as a normal point and shoot and still uses Electronic View Finder instead of a true Through The Lens optical viewfinder, as you would find on a DSLR(or a normal film SLR). The camera in Fuji's class are Panasonic FZ-30, Canon Digital Pro 1, Konica Minolta A200...etc. These camera offers most of the functionality of the SLR including full manual control, ability to shoot uncompressed RAW format, and usually fast response. But they lack the high ISO performance of a true SLR , and the comparatively limited depth of field control. Both are the result of the smaller sensor size. And although they do not have removable lens, they do offer a wide focal range to use, which often needs several different lens in a SLR package to cover. And as a result they ends up being a lot cheaper to use as well.

I havethe Konica Minolta Maxxum 5D(also known as Dynax 5D), it is a very capable entry in the entry level DSLR class, and the only one offers Built-In image stablization function, which is useful in long telephoto and low light situation. I am very happy with the camera and I think its a good value with the kit lens plus a few used lens. This camera like the Nikon D50 features a Sony made APS-C sized image sensor. Since this is smaller than a real 35mm film's image circle, it results in a image crop factor, effectively creates a multiplier for the focal length of the lens. In KM and Nikon's case results this is 1.5x, therefore a 100mm lens will effectively be used as a 150mm. The 2 Olympus camera you mentioned uses Olympus' "E-system". With a Four-Third system. These camera uses a image sensor made by Kodak, which is smaller than a industry norm APS-C sized sensor, results in a 2x crop factor. The system adapted by Olympus also includes a new lens mount, which renders their old lens obsolete, which means you'd have to buy new lens made by Olympus or third party manufacturer like Sigma. IMO this sortof limits your option in terms of lens as well as adding up the cost of buying new lens. With Nikon or KM you can use their older compatible mount and sometimes saves some money(I have bought so far 5 used lens for my 5D to compliment my kit lens). Factor like that are definitely worth considering when actually making the purchase.

As with anyone would suggest, go out and take a lookat these in person, maybe even bring a memory card and shoot some pictures with each and see which suits your taste and your ergonomic preference. As any one these camera are capable of turning out great pic.

ZAKD Dec 13, 2005 12:10 PM

Thanks for reply RacingManiac,

I understand lot of things you said.

Really need to know about differance in Mpx. I have powershot Nikon with 8 mpx and offered Olympus E-500 has a 8 Mpx, but what about those which are with 6.1Mpx like KonicaMinolta which is interest for me a lot. How much will I loose if I choose any with 6,1 Mpx.

Second question is that I heard about Nikon D50 which have no ISO100 but starts with ISO 200. Is this a problem at some possibilities. Are those pictures with much noise than normal.

I use a camera much for indoor shooting and portrait shooting.

Regards Zak

Nagasaki Dec 13, 2005 2:29 PM

the difference between 6 and 8 megapixels is not as much as it seems. The article here explains it very well

To sum up the number of megapixels is a measure of area. If you look at the differencein pixelwidthit's far less than you might exect 6Mp 3000 8Mp 3456. So I wouldn't say no to an 8mp camera but I wouldn't get too hung up abpout it either.

The D50 has a lowest ISO setting of 200 because it doesn't need anything lower. At 200 ISO it produces less noise than most compact do at 50 ISO. The main reason for this is that the sensor and therefore the photosites are much bigger. On a Mp for Mp basis a bigger sensor means less noise everything else being equal.

ZAKD Dec 13, 2005 4:36 PM

Thanks, see the point about Mpx and the ISO to Niokon D50.

Now at my opinion I could be satisfied with KonicaMinolta Dynax 5D or Nikon D50.

These are my first choice according to information that I have.

Is there something between this two thatone could be better than the other or never mind which one I choose it is almoust the same. Hope for your comments....:D

Regards Zak

Nagasaki Dec 13, 2005 5:36 PM

I use a D70, I really like this camera. To me it just feels right. My main reason for buying Nikon was a collection of lenses and a film SLR.

Problem with looking for this sort of advice is that most people can only comment about the camera they own and people tend to be fairly enthusiastic about the kit they buy.

Only people like Steve can really give an objective view on different models so read all the reviews you can find then go to a camera shop and get the camera in your hands and see how it feels to you.

I'm sure that the Nikon D50, The KM 5D and the Olympus are all great cameras and you will be happy with whichever you choose. I am a bit mixed on the Olympus. It has a smaller sensor than the others which usually means more noise, however it has a clever system for removing dust from the sensor which is a bug bear with DSLR cameras.

There is also the Canon Rebel XT also known as EOS 350D which is 8Mp but may be out of your price range.

RacingManiac Dec 14, 2005 11:25 AM

As mentioned MP counts between 6 and 8 is actually not that critical, unless you want to print anything really big. I've heard people who use 6MP SLR and still get a good result on a 11x20 print. So I think 6MP should be plenty. The additional issue for MP count in Olympus's case is this. E1 is a 5MP camera, for the E300/E500 they bump the MP count for the same sensor to 8MP, which is more taxing for the smaller sensor, and as a result worsen the noise situation for ISO level higher the 400. While I cannot say personally I've seen the picture first hand, most reviews do agree with this point.

KM 5D and Nikon D50/D70 actually shares the same Sony sensor, with 5D actually offers ISO 80-100, which I guess may be a bonus. But I've also seen in some review 5D's noise characteristic may not be as good as the Nikon, though I found no such issue with mine. I've heard Nikon D50 is a very user friendly camera, with built-in help function and such, and it was a tough decision between the D50 and 5D. I went with 5D because it offers the built-in image stablization, uses CF card, and I was a previous Minolta user in my DiMAGE Z1.

ZAKD Dec 14, 2005 7:32 PM

Thanks once again really. It will be hard for me to choose. There is also 58Eur price differance:?

One last question:

What does it mean the differance in lens:

Nikon D50 is with 18-55mm and

KM 5D is with 18-70mm.

IsKM D5 has a bonusbacause of the biger second number. I really do not know the lens of DSLR cameras.


Regards Zak

RacingManiac Dec 15, 2005 10:22 AM

unlike most Consumer Point & Shoot/Prosumer Camera, the "zoom" is not represented by magnification factor. In the case of my DiMAGE Z1, it features a "10x Optical" zoom. What it means in focal length term, is that my camera's lens has focal range(35mmfilm camera equivelent)from 38mm to 380mm. Effective 10x multiplication factor. What that failed to represent is exactly how far you are looking. If a camera can for 10mm to 100mm, it'll also be 10x zoom, but your actual telephoto ability will not be as far, however it'll be capable of much more wideangle.

In SLR, because you are able to switch lenses, that kind of designation will be meaningless because as mentioned, a 20-100mm lens will be 5X, but so will a 100-500mm lens, but you are shooting at a durastically different focal range. So in buying lens, they just use the actual lens focal range. In most DSLR there is the crop factor as I mentioned before, therefore the focal range labeled on the lens has to be multiplied by this number to get the "effective" focal range as you'd compare to a normal 35mm film camera. in KM 5D's case, the 18-70mm lens is effectively a 27-105mm lens on 5D which has a 1.5X crop factor. What that means compare to Nikon's 18-55mm is that it allows you to zoom in further. Apple to apple, it'll be like comparing 3.9x optical zoom on the 5D, vs 3x Optical Zoom on the D50, since both starts from 18mm and shares the same 1.5x crop factor.

To get a feel of what different focal range means, take a look at this page:

Better yet, take alook at your current camera's lens, it probably has label of what its focal range is, then from your experience you should be able to get an idea of whether the existing range is enough, or you might want to buy a different lens with your SLR...etc

ZAKD Dec 16, 2005 10:59 AM

Thanks a lot for all comments from both of you really you help a lot.

Still not decide bewtween this two model. Nikon D50 is a little less money but I love the image stabilizator on KM 5D.

I find in some magazin a big differance between this two models in size of files (JPG or RAW...) when the photo has been taken. For example on KM 5D RAW file is 8.8mbbut on Nikon D50 is 5.3mb... is there some differance in quality or somthing else is?

Regards Zak

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